Thursday, July 19, 2007

History of conversions to Christianity in Kerala – an overview

This article takes a brief look into the history of conversions to Christianity in Kerala. The Christians of the State can be broadly categorized into three: Syrian Christians who are believed to have been converted from the upper castes (whether such distinction existed at that time is not clear) by Apostle St. Thomas in 1c, Latin Christians who were converted mostly from lower classes by St. Francis Xavier in the 16c and Dalit Christians who were converted in the 19c by the Anglicans and in the 20c by the Catholic denomination of the Syrians. The labels Syrian and Latin came about because of the respective languages that were used in liturgy. (See: Jewish names among Syrian Christians.)

The Syrian Christian community is referred to by historians as Malabar Church and St. Thomas Christians. This congregation was, till the intrusion by the Western Christianity with the arrival of the Portuguese, a distinctive Eastern Church with the Pope of Rome as a hazy father figure at the far end of a thin long line.

Being a Syrian Christian is a matter of birth and inherited religious convictions. Therefore, conversion to that community is an anomaly. In all its known history till the 20c, the Malabar Church never undertook any missionary work. The theology of the community was that every human being achieved salvation through his own religion; a conclusion that modern Christian theology is increasingly accepting. Spreading the Word of Christ and induced or forced conversions to Christianity are two totally different things. As a result, the Syrian Christians remained an exclusive community to which outsiders had no entry.

Two questions arise here: why then did St. Thomas carry out conversions and, why did he convert only the so called upper classes? The Apostle would have, if one accepts oral tradition, received into the Christian fold only those who came forward willingly and out of conviction. On the question of the claimed class distinction in the conversions by the Apostle, it is necessary to understand the background of his mission. His arrival in Kerala (52A.D.) was before the gentiles were accepted into Christianity. Even the word ‘Christian’ did not exist at that time; it was coined in Antioch around 65 A.D. Till then the followers of Christ were known as Nazranis, a name that continues to be used in Kerala.

It is possible that St. Thomas initially targeted the Jews who were already in Kerala. (Several historians claim that the Jews were trading with Kerala even at the time of King Solomon.) Some of the upper crust local people too, presumably, joined the new faith. Here ‘upper crust’ would mean the educated or enlightened who, according to oral tradition, engaged the Apostle in debates.

The Malabar Church enjoyed an organic growth for fifteen centuries, blending with the social structure and being part of it, conforming to the customs and traditions of the land, maintaining upper class stature, receiving support and recognition from the rulers.

The Portuguese arrived in Kerala at the end of the 15c. They initiated a campaign to convert the local Christians (who followed Syriac liturgy) to the Latin Rite. This met with incessant resistance. The net result in the long run was that the Malabar Church was truncated and split into different denominations. Of these, the Catholic faction was subjugated by the Western Latin Church for three centuries.

The arrival of St. Francis Xavier in the middle of the 16c saw a flourish in missionary activity. This great saint of the Catholic Church converted many people of the lower castes to Christianity. He had the patronage of the Portuguese and the maharajas of Travancore and Cochin. In fact, the Maharaja of Cochin had the title ‘Protector of Christians’.

But there were protests against these conversions from the upper classes not on religious grounds but for social and economic reasons. Accepting Christianity released the converts from their obligations under the fine tuned caste system. This led to several problems. To give an example: the coconut pickers who became Christians were no longer under any compulsion to carry out their traditional duty.

This new congregation came to be known as Latin Christians. Whereas the Syrian Christians always enjoyed upper class status, the Latin Christians were treated as lower caste and there were hardly any social interaction between the two. After Independence, the Latin Christians were officially included in the backward class category.

The next round of conversions to Christianity in Kerala was in the 19c by the Anglicans, now known as Church of South India (CSI), who came to Kerala in the wake of the British in the first quarter of the 19c. This episode covered both Syrian Christians and members of some lower castes. The Anglicans championed major causes of the Dalits, like the right of Channar women to cover their breasts in public, and the abolition of slavery. This attracted lower castes to the new edition of Christianity in Kerala.

Then, in the early 1930s, the Syrian Catholic Church suddenly went on a conversion spree against all traditions of the St. Thomas Christians, focusing specifically on the Pulayas who were among the untouchables. They were bonded labor attached to landlords, both Hindu and Christian. Anizham Thirunal Maharaja abolished slavery in Travancore in the mid -19c, but the practice continued in one form or the other till the World War II. The Pulayas were totally at the mercy of their lords. The prospect of joining Christianity appealed to many of them.

Whether all these conversions were genuine, arising out of conviction is debatable. The details about the activities of St. Thomas in Kerala are shrouded in the foggy past. But by no stretch of imagination could he have had the political, financial or military clout to indulge in coercion. The subsequent conversions are unlikely to pass the test because there was an element of quid pro quo involved, in one way or another.

The present scenario in Kerala is that the label ‘Christians’ covers diverse groups without meaningful homogeneity or integration.

Ends.

Also see:

Vedas, Syrian Christians

264 comments:

1 – 200 of 264   Newer›   Newest»
Ezee123 said...

This is a nice summation of the rather confusing lot of christians in Kerala.

Jay said...

Thought of leaving you a message: I like your blog:)

RAJI MUTHUKRISHNAN said...

Nice blog. And this particular piece is very interesting in that it answers many of my questions.

Prakash Jose said...

I know that Syrian Chrisitans are upper caste and are superior to Nairs(all classes).but our dear Nairs wants to make a forged story of Chrisitans.I have seen a portal where a supposed Dr.Issac wrote that Syrian Christians are converted Parayas :lol: and claiming that the copper plates given to syrians by Kochi,Travancore Rajas are "forged" -height of stupidity by RSS,VHP,Nairs & Co. :x

Many families like mine(kokkattu-root family of Kallivayalil,Konduparambil,Kuruvinakkunnel,Pulikkuneel and many more...) have archived facts about their ancestry to a certain amount.all claims go to the moving of Arackal Mana near N.Parur to Cathedral Church Pala,Kottayam 1300 years back.

Now,St.Thomas was supposedly came to 7.5 places as officially recorded.
but,In Kothamangalam,Arakuzha(Muvattupuzha),Mylakompu(near Thodupuzha),Syrians claim openly that they are basically of the same place and St.Thomas came here for conversion of Namboodiri's,Unniyadiri's(now extinct,my mother's family{MadhathumChalil} traces origin to here).
This fact is proven,since Syrians here were having unique identity and are not having any roots from Thrissur Syrians or Kottayam Syrians.also here in this eastern part of Ernakulam district,the syrians were having "Mun-Kudummi" as recent as 200 years ago,which Namboodiri brahmins too have.the native Unnyadiri's are warrior people who are again Brahmins too!.
I liked your Blogging on Syrian Chrisitans Sir :)
also in news:Syrian Chrisitan population on decrease :( and suffers "parsi-syndrome"
http://ia.rediff.com/news/2002/oct/22ker.htm

Kariyachan said...

Good Day Sir;
I have been going through your really impressive and matter rich blogs for quite a while. There are a few factors which really attacted me.

a) You are from Thykattussery

b) You have really shed some light about the social set-up , especially of the Syrian Christians in Kerala.

c) You being a tharakan, and being really knowledgable , on family histories etc.

And foremost of all, Thykattuserry is my mothers place, and of fond nostalgic memories, I always used to be there around for vacations, and I studied at SMSJ school for a year. My maternal grand father used to teach there (chacko sir , madathiparambil).

I and am very happy for your efforts in recording certain facts about the by-gone era, which are not familar with the current generations.

I have read a half of your blog already,..

Joerose said...

Nice article, Uncle.
I happened to get into a discussion earlier this evening with a fellow classmate from Kerala and wanted to clarify some things on the two saints who made their way to southern India - so your piece came in very handy.
Do keep writing!

~Joerose.

sam said...

I'm a syrian christian. It stupefies me that people like you still cling on to myths and stories of ancestral piety made up by our ancestors. I don't know how you or I can claim superiority by claiming that we were upper caste hindus once. It doesn't make a difference.

The truth is St Thomas never came to kerala, and he for one wouldn't build churches. Churches are a congregation of people, not an old worn out building.

Read the bible, understand the Word of God and Cross of Christ should be the reason for your pride, not some falsified claims of syrian christians being superior to Nairs !!

Kariyachan said...

"The truth is St Thomas never came to Kerala"??

Where does this "truth" originate from?

Justin said...

Yes it is true. St. Thomas never came to Kerala. There is no firm HISTORICAL proof for that.

Prakash said...

well ,there was christians who are not Nestorians and who prays for mediation with "Amma Matavu" before portugese and even Tamil Epics got it written(eesanikal).
and ,Namboodiri's -where did they go ?do you ever thought about it?now they are less than 1% of kerala population.think!Syrian Chiristians in 3 districts-Kottayam/pathanamthitta ,Thrissur and Ernakulam/Idukki not all ,but most *may* claim the same -they were Namboodiris.but dont care much about the claim though.it is a traditional belief that St.Thomas came to convert.there are rumors like saint first came and several other times to northindia ,Iran ,Pakistan etc.second time he came south to Kerala.there are Syrians who believe St.Thomas visited their places in eastern areas.we cannot take a photo of St.Thomas in Paravoor for such questions!.
Thanks , - Prakash Jose Kokkattu
http://prakashjose.com

Cris said...

This was good reading! Especially now when conversions are hue and cry of the country. Quite educative, thanks!

deepak joseph said...

Pls chech this out the vatican has denied that st thomas came to indiaPope Leo XIII's Statement regarding Visit of St.Thomas to India
Earlier, in 1729 the Bishop of Madras-Mylapore doubted whether the tomb in San Thome Cathedral was that of St. Thomas and wrote to the Sacred Congregation of Rites in Rome for clarification. Rome's reply was not published.[26] Again, in 1871 the Roman Catholic authorities at Madras were "strong in disparagement of the special sanctity of the localities [viz. San Thome, Little Mount, and Big Mount identified by the Portuguese after 1517] and the whole story connecting St. Thomas with Mailapur."[27] However, in 1886 Pope Leo XIII stated in an apostolic letter that St. Thomas "travelled to Ethiopia, Persia, Hyrcania and finally to the Peninsula beyond the Indus",[28] and in 1923 Pope Pius XI quoted Pope Leo's letter and identified St. Thomas with "India". These papal statements also reflect the geography of the Acts of Thomas, as does Pope Benedict's statement, and make no reference to South India.
[edit]Statement of Congregation for the Causes of Saints
Though there are many historical evidences to support the tradition that St. Thomas came to South India, it has been claimed by few that on Nov. 13, 1952 Vatican officials sent a message to Kerala Christians stating that the landing of St. Thomas at Cranganore on Nov. 21, 52 A.D. was "unverified". [29] But, in a letter written in 1996 to one Ishwar Sharan who had sought confirmation of this official statement, the Vatican's reply was that they "have not found in their Archives the letter supposedly written by this Congregation on 13th November 1952" and that the life of St. Thomas was the object of historical research and not within his Congregation's competence. [30]
[edit]Pope Benedict XVI's Statement regarding Visit of St.Thomas to India
On September 27th 2006, Pope Benedict XVI gave out a speech in the Vatican in which he recalled an ancient tradition claiming that Thomas first evangelised Syria and Persia, then went on to Western India, from where Christianity also reached Southern India.[31].[32] Syrian Christians derive status within the caste system from the tradition that they are converted Namboodiris, who were allegedly evangelized by St. Thomas after he allegedly landed in Kerala in AD 52. But discrepency exists in this theory as Namboothiris started settling in kerala only from 6th century onwards.Since Pope Benedict XVI's statement was perceived to be a direct violation of their religious beliefs, many Saint Thomas Christians in India condemned this statement.[33]Later, based on the evidences given by Christians from Kerala, the Vatican amended the published text of the same speech with minor modifications.[34]

Jewish Carpenter Freak said...

I kinda agree with Sam here.. For one thing I don't know if St. Thomas ever visited kerala... that remains a mystery..but what is this huge claim that syrians came out of the upper castes? So in short Christians are not out of the caste system either!!! wow. and i for once thought that only hindus were a caste driven society... Christians are even cheaper for that matter!

Noel said...

Dear Abraham,

I’ve read a lot of articles written by Syrian Christians about their namboothiry ancestry, Jewish linage etc and their effort to classify Latin Christians as an inferior class. But let me ask one question to all Syrian Christians in Kerala. Except some ancient families and landlords which Syrian Christian in kerala had a royal past? Most of the so called Syrian Christians were land less “kudiyanmar” of either Nairs or Brahmins. Just search the registrar offices of kerala and find out.

Everybody in kerala knows about the reason behind the Kizhakkan mala kudiyettam. The naduvazhi / raja / jenmi owned forests they got as bhiksha and worked like donkeys. Only after the third generation, the Achayanmar got the social status, money glamour etc. They sent their daughters to far away places to study nursing and finally landed in gulf or Europe and thus started the money flow. My dear Namboothiri Christians after these struggles of your grandparents only you got the current status in the society.

At the same time the central kerala latins consist of both feudal land lords, middleclass and fishermen (Come to Alappuzha, I’ll show you Syrian Catholics who goes for fishing both in sea and fresh waters). Latins never had any Nair or Namboothiri janmis. The fishermen latins were the kudiyans of powerful Latin landlords. Ask the old generation of Ernakulam and Alappuzha districts and try to see at least the old homes of ancient latin families, and feel the royalty.

My father belongs to an ancient Latin family and my mother belongs to Syrian family. My father’s family had acres of own land from generations and my grandfather (mother side) got 10 cents from a Nair jenmy as kudikidappavagasham. This is the difference.

I agreed all Syrians are not like this and at the same time all the Latins are not like what the Syrian Christians are trying to spread.

This Syrian Christian effort to gain status by fabricating stories of Brahmin background will make you jokers in front of other casts.

Stella said...

It is true. Syrian Christians tend to spread the lie that Latin Catholics are from lower caste whereas they are ALL from upper caste. Is this true? Absolutely not, not all syrians are upper caste and not ALL latins are from the lower caste. But what the heck, christians are not supposed to believe or practise the caste system. So those who still want to cling to this idiotic system can always go back to Hinduism.

joy said...

Dear Abraham,
Nice piece of work. Answers a lot of questions a Syrian Catholic like me born and brought up outside Kerala had. Kerala Christians can be proud of not whether their forefathers were brahmins, but for the huge educational intitutions they built . These institutions have made kerala what it is today. you go to any part of the world you find a malayali at the helm of affairs.

Joy Devassy
Mumbai
India

manoj said...

This theory about upper caste ancestry is neither supported by history or genetics. It is silly to claim that St Thomas converted people from upper Hindu castes in the first century because Kerala was probably a largely uninhabited land at that time. Society at that time could hardly have been organised into castes like Brahmins, Nairs, Ezhavas or Pulayas and what not. There is very little evidence that Hinduism existed in Kerala at that time. At the most there could have been isolated groups of tribal communities. All people of KErala, whether so called 'upper caste' or 'lower caste' draw their ancestry from diverse groups, including indigenous people, migrants from other parts of India and migrants from other parts of the world. So much for your claim of 'superior' genes. We all are a mixed people. Claims of upper caste origins are made by half literates or those neo-rich trying to create a fairy tale about their imaginary past.

ZODIONS said...

WE FIND ALL THESE SO STUPID AND GIBBERISH.THE MAIN POINT HERE IS THAT WHILE NAIRS ARE UNITED OF THEIR IDENTITY.MOST SYRIAC CHRISTIANS FIGHT AMONG EACH OTHER SO ALL FAIL.
THERE ARE PROOF TO SHOW NAIRS WERE ORGINALLY FROM NAGA TRIBALS WHO AS OF THEIR WARRIOR INSTINCTS WERE ADOPTED INTO THE HINDU NOBLE CLASS IN AMONG THE LARGE BUNT COMMUNITY.FIRST AND FOREMOST PROOF IS THE MATRIARCHY THEY FOLLOWED WERE BASICALLY THE TRIBAL STRUCTURE.

ABOUT THE BRAHMIN ORGIN OF SYRIAC CHRISTIANS.WE SHOULD NOTE THAT THERE ARE A VERY FEW FAMILIES THAT STILL FOLLOW THE NAMBOOTHIRI VEDIC PUROHIT WAY OF LIFE.LIKE THE PUNOOL,VEGETARIANISM AND MANY OTHERS.THEY ARE BY FAITH ANCIENT CHRISTIANS BUT BY CUSTOM AND WAY OF LIFE,TRUELY NAMBOOTHIRI BRAHMIN WAY OF LIFE.MANY FAMILIES EVEN HAD RIGHTS IN TEMPLE AS THAILASHANTHI'S FOR PURIFICATION OF TEMPLE AND OTHERS FOR POLLUTION ABOUT TILL 1930'S.
SO LETS REALLY LIVE IT OUT AND FIND THE REAL CONTEXT RATHER THAN FIGHT IT OUT.

ZODIONS said...

AS ABOUT ST.THOMAS CONVERTING ONLY UPPER CLASS BRAHMINS.MARTHOMA SLEEHA WAS A RABBI BY PROFESSION AND BIRTH SO HE HAD PRIVELEDGES IN ROYAL COURTS TO SEE THE ELDERS AND PUROHITS FOR THEOLOGICAL REASONING.WHY NOT THE LOWER CLASS.AS A ROYAL DECREE AN AMBASSADOR LIKE ST.THOMAS COULD NOT MEET THE LOWER CLASS THE ADHIKARI'S WOULD NEVER ALLOW THAT OR EVEN SAY THEY HAD A LOW CASTE PEOPLE.IT WAS LIKE NOT HAVING THE TOILETS IN THE HOUSE BUT THEY ALWAYS WERE THERE OUTSIDE QUITE BIG WHICH WAS KEPT OFF OTHERS.WE SHOULD TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE NON TIME AND ERA THAT THIS HAPPENED.
EVEN FOR THE JEWISH COMMUNITY IN ISRAEL WHICH WAS STRICTLY ENDOGAMOUS THEY HAD CLASSES FOR PEOPLE LIKE PRIESTS,ROYALS,SUB RULERS,CARPENTERS-ARCHITECTS AND BUILDERS,TAXCOLLECTORS,FISHERMEN ETC.IT LIKE HAVING A WHOLE COUNTRY OF BRAHMINS WHAT DO THEY DO.THEY MAKE UP CLASSES TO LIVE IT OUT.

SO THE POINT THAT CHRIST WAS A CARPENTER AND ALL DOESNOT FIT INTO A CASTE STRUCTURE OF INDIA.THE HISTORY ALWAYS REPRESENTS THE RULERS IF WE HAD CHRISTIAN RULERS LIKE THE KURU VARMAN 1ST IN 6 CENTURY FOR LONG TIME.WE COULS HAVE THE HISTORY WRITTEN THE OTHER WAY OF WHAT IT IS NOW.IF SHOULD ALSO LOOK AT THE PERSIAN PROBLEM.ONCE THE WHOLE AREA WAS CHRISTIAN TILL TE ADVENT OF ISLAM.WOULD ANYONE THERE IN HISTORY AGREE NOW,NO NEVER.SAME IN AFGANISTHAN WHICH WAS ONCE RULED BY OUR OWN KING BHARATHA AND SHAKUNTHALA.WHAT ABOUT NOW,ONLY WE IN INDIA SAY THIS.OTHER HISTORY STATES THAT IT WAS ALWAYS A TRUE ISLAM LAND.THIS IS HOW HISTORICAL FACTS ARE WRITTEN FOR THE KING AND IS FAMILY.

ABOUT VATICAN DENIAL,THEY ARE AFRAID IF THEY ACCEPT ST.THOMAS AS AN APOSTLE IN KERALA AND INDIA.THEY MIGHT LOOSE THE EDGE AS THE POWER HOUSE AS CHRISTIANS ARE DECREASING IN EUROPE DAY BY DAY WHILE KEEPING ITS PACE IN KERALA.

THE NAIRS ANDITS SUBCLASS WERE AMALGAMTED INTO THE NOBLE CLASS BY GIVING GIRLS INTO SAMBANDHAM OR SECRET NAME SAKE MARRIAGE FOR THE ROYALS AND OTHERS.THUS OVER A TIME FRAME MANY NAIRS WOULD HAVE RULERS AS THEIR COUSINS.A GREAT HISTORICAL AUTHOR CALLED THEM FATHERLESS PEOPLE FOR ONLY THE WOMEN WERE IMPORTANT AND PRACTISED POLYANDRY IN AN EXTRAORDINARY WAY.THAT MADE KERALA BRANTHALAYAM OR MAD PEOPLE'S PLACE BY THE GREAT SAGE SWAMI VIVEKANADA.

THE SYRIAC CHRISTIAN COMMUNITY KEPT THE WOMEN SECLUDED AND HOLY LIKE THE NAMBOOTHIRIS NEVER EVER MARRIED TO ANYONE OTHER THEIR CLASS
AND STUCTURE.THIS MADE THEM ALIENATED FROM THE RULING CLASS AND OTHERS WHICH FORGOT THE PRIVILEDGES FOR THEM ON THE LONG RUN.
ALSO THE COMING OF PORTUGESE LED THEM TO A NEW EUROPEAN CUSTOMS LIKE GIVING UP VEGETERIANSIM AND FOR MORE INSULT TO ROYALS STARTED EATING BEEF WHICH LED TO BEING DESCRIMINATED FROM THE TEMPLES AND OTHERS.THE NEW PORTUGESE WAY OF LIFE AMONG A SECTION OF THE SYIAC CHRISTIAN COMMUNITY LED TO ANCIENT
ISSANIA COMMUNITY OF ST.THOMAS BEING DICRIMINATED BY THE ROYALS FROM THE AT SAME PAR WITH BRAHMINS POLICY EARLIER.
THE PRESENT TRUTH IS THAT NAMBOOTHIRIS ARE THE WORST POVERTY STRICKEN AND POOR CLASS IN KERALA.ONLY THE PRIESTHOOD REMAINS WITH THEM EVEN THAT HAS STARTED TO BE GIVEN TO OTHERS TOO,MAYBE A 100 YRS FROM NOW.THE NAMBOOTHIRIS MIGHT BE THE LIKE OLD LOW CLASS.

WE ARE INA GOD FORSAKEN COUNTRY AND ERA.MAY GOD,LORD INVERVENE TO SE ALL PEOPLE ARE EQUAL AND GOOD IN THE COMING TIMES.

Nik said...

So far i have not known of castes like Nairs or Namboodiris with Aryan lineage drawing their history that far. In fact there is not enough proof that Indo-Aryan civilization has spread this far South in AD 52. I wonder where this story came of from. Either St.Thomas did convert, but it was not Nairs or Nambudiris or it is also possible that these upper castes were converted at a later point. Hair style or such things are never a proof - not only Nairs and Nambudiris, even Chekavars and some lower strata of the then society had such practices.

Prime most thing one better follow with history is that there are a host of various possibilities in history. It can never be narrated like a story without acknowledging the variant possibilities.

ZODIONS said...

DEAR THARAKAN,

SORRY,MAYBE YOU NEED A FULL HISTORY STUDY.DO YOU KNOW FROM WHERE THE GREAT PRIME MINSTER OF PATALIPUTRA(PATNA),AUTHOR OF ARTHASASTHRA -CHANAKYA CAME FROM IT WAS INFACT KOLLAM A ANCIENT PLACE OF THE SAME NAME IN KOTTYAM.

THE WORD NAIR OR NAMBOOTHIRI IS WHAT CONFUSES YOU,THATS THE PROBLEM. THE NAIRS WERE NAGAS WHO CAME FROM AHICHATRA NEAR PRESENT DAY RAMPUR,UTTAR PRADESH WHICH WAS PART OF A SOUTH NEPAL KINGDOM IN ANCIENT ERA-WHY THAT WAS THE ONLY CASTE THAT PRACTICED POLYANDRY AND GIRL FAMILY WAY OR MARUMAKKATHYAM AS WE CALL.THEY CAM INTO SOUTH KANNADA BY THE INVITATION OF THE KING MAYURA VARMA TO HELP HIM INVADE AND CAPTURE MANY AREAS.SOME BRAHMINS CAME WITH THEM.BUT AS GENES GO THEY MIGHT NOT HAVE BEEN OF FAIR SKIN.

THERE WERE MANY PUROHIT BRAHMIN COMMUNITIES THAT CAME FROM KONKAN,MARATHA,SAURASTHRA ON EARLIER TIMES FOR PRIESTLY AND OTHER PURPOSES.THE SO CALLED RIGID CASTE SYSTEM CAM EFFECT IN KERALA BY ONLY THE 12TH CENTURY THATS WHEN NAIR CHIEFS INVADED AND RULED AREAS IN NORTH AND CENTRAL KERALA.THE NAME NAMPOOTHIRI LIKE BHATTATHIRIPAD(WHICH MEANS HIGHLY LEARNED ONE)WAS CONFERED TO BRING TOGETHER THE PRIESTLY COMMUNITIES BY ROYALS AND SANAKARCHARYA WHO LED A HUGE SAIVA/HINDU REVIVAL IN KERLA BY 9TH CENTURY.

EVEN THE NAMPOOTHIRIS SAY(EVEN IF THEY DONT PUBLICISE ON IT) THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN HERE BY AT LEAST 500BC OR EARLIER AS BRAHMIN PRESCENCE WAS FELT IN SRILANKA BY 550 BC.WE DONT HAVE MUCH EVIDENCE FOR THIS AS THERE WAS A SUDDEN CHANGE FROM ANCIENT CALENDARS TO MALAYALAM CALENDAR BY 8TH CENTURY-WHY WAS THIS?WAS IT TO AVOID THE EARLIER HISTORY OF BRAHMIN CHRISTIAN KINGS THAT RULED KERALA,ONLY GOD KNOWS.SO MANY THEORIES ARE THERE.
THE KINGDOM OF VILLIARVATTOM IN UDAYAMPEROOR(ERNAKULAM) BY KING THOMA AND QUEEN MARY ARE SUPPOSED TO HAVE COMMUNICATED BY THE CHRISTIAN KING OF PORTUGAL.SOME PROOF IS THERE IN LISBON ARCHIVES PORTUGAL-DID THEY INVITE VASCO DA GAMA OR DID HE COME ON HIS OWN IS A MILLION DOLLAR PROBLEM.
THE KINGDOM WAS ABSORBED INTO COSHIN ROYAL FAMILY BY THE EARLY 15TH CENTURY AS THE LAST PRINCE BECAME A MONK AND HIS SISTER PRINCESS MARY WAS MARRRIED BY PRINCE OF COCHIN ROYAL FAMILY.

ST.THOMAS CHRISTIANS ARE A COMMUNITY OF THOSE PRIESTLY BRAHMINS PUROHITS WHO WERE STARTLED BY ST.THOMAS BY HIS THEOLOGY AND GODLY KNOWLEDGE.
RECENTLY DNA TESTING OF SOME MEMBERS OF PAKALOMATTOM FAMILY HAVE BEEN FOUND TO HAVE A COHEN HAPLOTPYE ONLY FOUND IN RAREST OF THE TOP CHIEF RABBIS OF ISRAEL.
SOME CHITHPAVAN BRAHMINS OF KONKAN HAVE ALSO FOUND TO HAVE SAME DNA.
THERE WERE JEWISH COMMUNITIES IN KONKAN AS WELL.SOME DROWNED AND SHIP WRECKED IN KONKAN LATER WERE ABSORBED INTO THE CHITHPAVAN BRAHMIN COMMUNITIES.

THESE ARE ALL THEORIES AND FACTS,WHY MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT BE GOOD TO YOU.YOU CAN LIKE WHAT YOU TAKE ITS A WHOLE NEW WORLD.

deepak joseph said...

this blog stress on the caste system rather than facts..sorry to say that!!

ZODIONS said...

DEAR DEEPAK,

SORRY,WE ANY OF THIS HAS BEEN OF HURT TO YOU,CASTE /CLASS IS A REALITY.NOW WE EVEN HAVE CASTE CENSUS,LETS FACE IT IN PRIDE AND HAPPINESS.OUR LORD WAS PROUD OF THE FACT THAT HE WAS A JEW.HE LIVED AND PRAISED AND ALWAYS BEEN A GOOD MUMBER OF HIS CASTE/CLASS.HE WAS ALSO ANGRY WITH MANY CUSTOMS AND PRATICES FOR WHICH LORD OFTEN AGITATED.

LETS US ALL PRAY FOR THE ONENESS AND GOODNESS FOR OUR FELLOWSHIP IN ALL.

limesh said...

Hi All,

Nice to see this blog and various castes among Christian groups,Lol.
By birth I am also Syrian Christian( Orthodox) and belongs to Manarcadu, Kottayam(Nasranis fort).But Now I am in Mao's camp.The most attracting thing over here is that Maoes not following any caste or religious system.We are aiming for the creation of people's republic of India with limited religious freedom(Mao is against that and named it as 'cocaine". Fortunately,due to my buttering Mao finally accepted and approved distribution of 'cocaine' in a limited manner only for Keralites:)
Hope Keralites will use it according to requirement and refrain from over dose!!!

MITHUN said...

Stupid arguments.For what heck should Nair and Namboodiris turn to christians..In ancient time they had power,money and good worship in Hinduism than any other low caste Hindu groups.They are not bound for easy conversion.It would have been believable if now so Christians in Kerala where converted from low caste because they didnt had money,power etc,..Now for God sake you guys keep up your mind in the name of GOD and live.Dont go for this rubbish arguments

S.raj said...

In india or kerala the lower caste people are attracted towards the christianity.Since in ancient times they have no money ,power,and worshipping gods.So they need a change
My jewish carpenter you dont know,what people are doing here

C.N.VALSAN said...

Bramins(Namboothiris)arrived in Kerala from North only during the period of 4C & 7C, till then only Dravidian culture was prevailing here. How come MarThoma converted people from that community who were not existent here at all?
C.N.Valsan

sam said...

It is shame when syrian christians take pride of saying that they are brahmins and consider latin catholics as low class. Just take a MOMENT AND THINK...who are christians? The followers of christ. Jesus did carpentry jobs and his disciples included fishermen and tax collectors....It is not the job or family status that creates good people....Whoever accepts the words of god are christians and whoever does good for their fellowbeings...

Shino said...

some people are arguing that they are superior . I think no one is superior to anyone. Its a state of mind.

The best word suits here is "Oru Jathi Oru Matham Oru Devam Manusyanu" we all call him in different names.

Joshy said...

Well, after reading all these " claims" by all bloggers, it looks like most of the things are imaginary, and created for some selfish purpose.

It is still a myth that St Thomas came to India or not, who knows. One thing is certain, a lot of people by the name Thomas came to Kerala ( India) during those days. Thomas was a common name in Palestine,Mesopotamia province at that time. People in certain parts of South America, and in some East European countries also claim about the arrival of St Thomas. How did Thomas travel in a span of short time - There were no flights at that time.

The other thing is, if St Thomas was a disciple of JEsus CHrist he shouldn't have shown discrimination by " converting" only the Namboothiris or Brahmins. History shows that those sect of people came to Kerala in 7th Centuray.
Please note that Jesus Christ has followers from all aspects of life during his life time ( Tax collectors, Fishermen, Woman, Prostitutes, and all those) who were considered as "LOW" by the then society. The Bible clearly shows all these things.
Then why people are trying to create some sort of hierarchy from some false claims.
Any way who are Brahmins, Namboothiris, Nayars, Pulayas, Vedas, Jews , christians ( orthodox, RC, .... lots), other sects , and Chosen People etc, etc.
Well these are names given by Human beings, and not by God. These segregations are simply selfish motives by human beings created at some stage in the history for attaining materialistic gains.

Joshy said...

Addendum to the previous blog by me

I forgot to mention a few other things --

Mr Abraham Tharakan's article above ( history of conversions to Christianity) is a false historical statement.
The whole article expresses author's radical ideology, and dogma of racism. " Upper cast", and " lower cast" are mentioned at several places, in the article. This reflexes the racist, and cast oriented mentality. Of course this mentality is a matter of birth, and inherited cultural convictions from generations. The term upper cast or lower cast does not symbolize either Syrian Christian or any denomination.

Racial statements may be a violation of human rights ( Ref: Universal declaration of Human RIghts - UN)

It is true that non one can help, or modify
people's attitude which they learned, and inherited from generations. This phenomenon was there from time immemorial, and still there worldwide.

When human beings evolved, and migrated out of Africa, the "Mitochondrial Eve" or The " Y " Adam, never thought that human skin color, phenotype would have changed as a result of adaptation to climate, and sunlight. They never imagined about M 168 mutation would have occurred. Their collective intelligence, and the greatest tool " The Language" brought us to this 21st Century.

Joshy said...

Correction in the last para above

---thought that human skin color, and phenotypical
appearance would have changed as a ------


-----they never imagined that 168 mutation would have occurred.------

P.C.Joseph said...

It is absurd to state that Hard working Kerala Christians are descendants of fun loving Namboothiries who were lazy to work, and enjoyed life day and night. Kerala Christians fought with un- inhabitable hills and marsh lands and made Kerala the kingdom of spices to the envy of the world. They had their own distinctive culture, traditions separate from Hindus.They believed in community living and simple life. They encouraged savings in immovable properties and slowly grabbed the lands from Namboothiries when ever they got a chance. Their moral standards were high and they loved their families and educated their children. Those who want to know more about Kerala Christians should study the books of historian Sooranattu Kunjan Pillai. It is a pity that the syrian catholic bishops and priests are trying to hide the truth from the simple and ordinary followers of Christ and the public. P.C.Joseph

P.C.Joseph said...

It is absurd to state that Hard working Kerala Christians are descendants of fun loving Namboothiries who were lazy to work, and enjoyed life day and night. Kerala Christians fought with un- inhabitable hills and marsh lands and made Kerala the kingdom of spices to the envy of the world. They had their own distinctive culture, traditions separate from Hindus.They believed in community living and simple life. They encouraged savings in immovable properties and slowly grabbed the lands from Namboothiries when ever they got a chance. Their moral standards were high and they loved their families and educated their children. Those who want to know more about Kerala Christians should study the books of historian Sooranattu Kunjan Pillai. It is a pity that the syrian catholic bishops and priests are trying to hide the truth from the simple and ordinary followers of Christ and the public. P.C.Joseph

P.C.Joseph said...

It is absurd to state that Hard working Kerala Christians are descendants of fun loving Namboothiries who were lazy to work, and enjoyed life day and night. Kerala Christians fought with un- inhabitable hills and marsh lands and made Kerala the kingdom of spices to the envy of the world. They had their own distinctive culture, traditions separate from Hindus.They believed in community living and simple life. They encouraged savings in immovable properties and slowly grabbed the lands from Namboothiries when ever they got a chance. Their moral standards were high and they loved their families and educated their children. Those who want to know more about Kerala Christians should study the books of historian Sooranattu Kunjan Pillai. It is a pity that the syrian catholic bishops and priests are trying to hide the truth from the simple and ordinary followers of Christ and the public. P.C.Joseph

manu said...

thank god,All of you agreed that you all are converted HINDUS.So there doesnt arise any such questions that from upper caste or lower caste because converted are the lowest caste and the one who fought against the circumstances but not agreed to change his father and get converted is above all the christians in india.
And if any christians being so proud be christians why the heck you follow the hindus in your activities?? see the changes taking place in the recent past in your churches,,the flag hosting,chenda melam,,kal vilakku,even now the churches are built in the way the temples are. your relegous leaders are depended by the hindu relegious support are beggined to learn yoga,meditation,and ayurveda,which are the part of vedas, If you agree i understand that you all on the way to recognise the prime religion and get converted mentally to HINDU.
None of you have read history in detail...please study..

A.Yeshuratnam said...

There was a steady influx of Middle Eastern immigrants, Arabs, Persians, Syrians and others from Central Asia, long before the birth of Christianity and Islam. A very extensive trade and economic link existed directly between Kerala and the Middle East since time immemorial. The Jews claim that the first Jew arrived in Kochi in King Solomon’s merchant fleet (970B.C.). Logan assumes: “Perhaps as early as the time of Moses, the great Jewish law-giver, this commerce existed, for cinnamon and cassia played a part in the temple services of the Jews.” The Chinese and Arabs were among the prominent foreign nationals who traded with the Zamorin of Calicut. The Chinese had a small-fortified colony of their own in Calicut and it was known at that time as Chinakotta or Chinese fort. The immigrants were given the status of higher caste and they were allowed to enjoy the privileges of higher castes by the Zamorin and other kings of Kerala. St. Thomas would have converted these immigrants. . When Ibn Batuta visited the Malabar Coast he found merchants not only from Arabia and Egypt, but also from Zanzibar and Ethiopia and even Tunis. It is likely St.Thomas would have converted many of these immigrants. In a caste-ridden, superstitious and conservative society, it was impossible to get higher caste Hindus to marry the immigrants. The wives and concubines of the immigrants were from untouchable castes such as mukkuvas, pariahs and Ezhavas. Kerala rulers allowed the wives and children of immigrants to enjoy the privileges of higher castes. Conversion of the families of immigrants by St. Thomas is wroingly interpreted as conversion of Nambbooditris, although there were no Namboodiris at the tine of his arrival. Earlier texts such as Thomma Parvam are all not contemporary accounts of Ist Century A.D. but later accounts after a lapse of several hundred years, and therfore, are mere exaggeration, fabrication and imaginary. But it is a historical fact that, before the arrival of European powers, Christian immigrants and their native descendants of Kerala had links with Eatern Christianity that flourished at that time in Mesopotamia, Assyria, Syria (Aramea), Phoenicia and Egypt. The contact was only occasional due to difficulties in travel and political anarchy that prevailed in the Middle East. The arrival of Thomas of Cana with 400 men increased Christian population when he and his companions married local women belonging to untouchable castes. He is portrayed as a Jew by some Syrian Christian families, but Armenian records and Portuguese accounts categorically say that he was an Armenian merchant.
Most studies of social change in Kerala have focused on the institution of caste and the extent of social mobility of various castes. Syrians at the time of the arrival of colonial powers were landless and they were not even peasant cultivators. Political and social exigencies of the period compelled them to increase Syrian Christian population by large scale conversion of lower castes, outcastes and slaves by Metrans and church leaders. Syrian Bishop Mar Coorilos met Grant Duff, the Governor of Madras, at Calicut in January1882 and gave him a lengthy account of Syrians in Kerala. He told him, “This Christian community subsisted and gradually increased, both by its intrinsic elements and by the admission of new converts, from the people living in the neighborhoods of Syrian churches.” (Logan, Malabar Manual, p.197). So, even before the arrival of European powers, native Syrian church had converted many local people who were not Brahmins or Nairs but only lower castes (mainly coastal mukkuvas and Ezhavas) who were known as untouchables.

rps said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
rps said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Royal Nasrani said...

I have gone through all comments and i feel pity that all are "emotional beings" rather than just sticking to the historical facts of what was Mr.Abrahams approach to research on a topic on origin of syrians.MY DEAR FRIENDS HISTORY IS NOT EMOTIONAL AT ALL ITS JUST THE FACT THAT SPEAKS AND THE STRONG PASSION TO KNOW ONE'S ANCESTORY,WHY TAKING IT NEGATIVE and jesus never told us to divide and ractice casteism but its even not a crime to know ones history…is it???
Obviously we will be eager...postive additions from strong research are good rather than emotinal inputs.
It has become a modern scholarly fashion to deny anything and everything in the fields of literature and history. This tendency takes the force of a tornado when it comes to religion and Bible. Whatever was established as absolute truth in the past centuries have become suddenly the object of much disputation and doubts. Hence we hear great scholars claiming that Moses never existed, Joshua never existed, Isaiah never existed, Hittites never existed, gospels were not written by the apostles etc, etc.
Even in modern times one hears that Shakespeare never wrote the plays which are credited to his name throughout the previous centuries! This is the modern scholarship! When one considers this “modern” phenomenon, one gets to know the real cause BEHIND this development and can pinpoint it as ……the theory of evolution!! Yes, it has revolutionized the modern scholarship so thoroughly that today whoever opposes this “theory” is considered as “uneducated”. This theory (which works BEHIND the modern scholarship) in history and literature goes something like this: that the modern human beings are at the latest stage of advanced evolutionary spectrum and the ancient people were not as “evolved” as we are in intellectual faculty and hence we cannot depend on their statements and historical records.
In the Biblical textual criticism, one scholar named Julius Wellhausen changed all the previously held concepts. He claimed that Moses never wrote the Pentateuch, that in fact the Old Testament was orally transmitted fables which were recorded at different periods in time by different people and that the Pentateuch is a “synthesis” of at least four traditions (Yahwist, Elohist, Priestly and Deuteronomical). Gradually this spirit of distrust on the word of God spread to almost all the books in the Bible.
This is in spite of the fact that Jesus Himself claimed emphatically several times that “Moses WROTE” the Pentateuch (John 5:46, Mark 10:5 as examples). So either Jesus is a liar or Wellhausen is a liar. But if Jesus is a liar then we do not have a Savior, there is no Messiah, there is no redemption, there is no Christianity and there is NO NASRANIS! Then those ancient prophets and apostles who forsook everything including their family and ultimately gave up their lives for the name of Christ were all idiots and fools!
But the modern archeological excavations have been proving time and again that the persons, the places, the races and the incidents are as historical as what is happening today. Moreover, archaeology has proven that the art of writing was used even before Moses’ time. Moses could write the Law because he “was instructed in all the wisdom of Egyptians and was powerful in words and in works” (Acts 7:22). Remember Egypt was the super power when Moses was raised as the son for 40 years in the palace of Pharaoh (Acts 7:23). So God made sure that he got the best.
Who were the early Christian converts in Kerala when Thomas came? We know from the Bible that God and Jesus Christ never discriminated people based on the color, class, caste, wealth, sex, social status etc. Thomas also would not do the same.
However certain practical elements would have made a big difference in conversion. If you go through the Bible one thing becomes clear. The Bible is mostly addressed to those who knew reading and writing. This is not discrimination from God’s part but a practical blockade made by man himself.
education available!!

Royal Nasrani said...

I have gone through all comments and i feel pity that all are "emotional beings" rather than just sticking to the historical facts of what was Mr.Abrahams approach to research on a topic on origin of syrians.MY DEAR FRIENDS HISTORY IS NOT EMOTIONAL AT ALL ITS JUST THE FACT THAT SPEAKS AND THE STRONG PASSION TO KNOW ONE'S ANCESTORY,WHY TAKING IT NEGATIVE and jesus never told us to divide and ractice casteism but its even not a crime to know ones history…is it???
Obviously we will be eager...postive additions from strong research are good rather than emotinal inputs.
It has become a modern scholarly fashion to deny anything and everything in the fields of literature and history. This tendency takes the force of a tornado when it comes to religion and Bible. Whatever was established as absolute truth in the past centuries have become suddenly the object of much disputation and doubts. Hence we hear great scholars claiming that Moses never existed, Joshua never existed, Isaiah never existed, Hittites never existed, gospels were not written by the apostles etc, etc.
Even in modern times one hears that Shakespeare never wrote the plays which are credited to his name throughout the previous centuries! This is the modern scholarship! When one considers this “modern” phenomenon, one gets to know the real cause BEHIND this development and can pinpoint it as ……the theory of evolution!! Yes, it has revolutionized the modern scholarship so thoroughly that today whoever opposes this “theory” is considered as “uneducated”. This theory (which works BEHIND the modern scholarship) in history and literature goes something like this: that the modern human beings are at the latest stage of advanced evolutionary spectrum and the ancient people were not as “evolved” as we are in intellectual faculty and hence we cannot depend on their statements and historical records.
In the Biblical textual criticism, one scholar named Julius Wellhausen changed all the previously held concepts. He claimed that Moses never wrote the Pentateuch, that in fact the Old Testament was orally transmitted fables which were recorded at different periods in time by different people and that the Pentateuch is a “synthesis” of at least four traditions (Yahwist, Elohist, Priestly and Deuteronomical). Gradually this spirit of distrust on the word of God spread to almost all the books in the Bible.
This is in spite of the fact that Jesus Himself claimed emphatically several times that “Moses WROTE” the Pentateuch (John 5:46, Mark 10:5 as examples). So either Jesus is a liar or Wellhausen is a liar. But if Jesus is a liar then we do not have a Savior, there is no Messiah, there is no redemption, there is no Christianity and there is NO NASRANIS! Then those ancient prophets and apostles who forsook everything including their family and ultimately gave up their lives for the name of Christ were all idiots and fools!
But the modern archeological excavations have been proving time and again that the persons, the places, the races and the incidents are as historical as what is happening today. Moreover, archaeology has proven that the art of writing was used even before Moses’ time. Moses could write the Law because he “was instructed in all the wisdom of Egyptians and was powerful in words and in works” (Acts 7:22). Remember Egypt was the super power when Moses was raised as the son for 40 years in the palace of Pharaoh (Acts 7:23). So God made sure that he got the best.
Who were the early Christian converts in Kerala when Thomas came? We know from the Bible that God and Jesus Christ never discriminated people based on the color, class, caste, wealth, sex, social status etc. Thomas also would not do the same.
However certain practical elements would have made a big difference in conversion. If you go through the Bible one thing becomes clear. The Bible is mostly addressed to those who knew reading and writing. This is not discrimination from God’s part but a practical blockade made by man himself.
education available!!

Royal Nasrani said...

There are 2 kinds of historians one is "TAKING A CONCLUSION AND RESEARCHING ON ALL FACTS THAT PROOVES HIS CONCLUSION CORRECT"
2nd one is "DOING A GREAT RESEARCH ON ALL FACTS AND REFERENCES AND COCLUDING"....so be aware when you comment which one you like to be???..


1.Many has claimed that Namboothiris came in the 6th to 7th century-A mass migration was been recorded but that never claimed that there was no namboothiris in CHERA KINGDOM.even if we take the Pandyan history or the sangam age referances we come to know that Buddism,jainism & vedic pandits used to debate in front of the Pandyan kings to "market" their so called religions.Yes mass migration and VARNA system was introduced in the later ages.
2.Also ,syrian christians are a mixed group .
3.And some friends have quoted that how can a prestigious namboodiris get converted infact of their social upper status...Do you think St.Thomas can explain to the common masses as they were illiterate and only namboothiris or rulers or some other pundits or literate classes only could “understand” a religion as they were the only learning and literate community.How can St.Thomas preach between the uneducated mass they even were not allowed to learn or accept anything???Thus he influenced only the influential masses .
4.And about the CHERA KINGDOM,Chera kingdom is not a NAIR kingdom as they were patrilineal as reversed to NAIRS (as they were matrilineal)even they claim that they were descendants of cheras…Cheras were dravidians and also engaged ARYAN migrants to debate and learn religion with busddist & jain scholars and also to be teachers of them.SANGAM age poems speak about many migrants in the neighbouring pandya kingdom.
And also there is no point in “emotional “ debates whatsoever our ancestory ….we should search for the history not to disturb others EGO or get our EGO disturbed.FACT has to be researched.

ME2 said...

okey if syrians agree to there brahamin ancestary ,,why do they have a love to eat PORK ,BEEF,cow ,odumb,vedi erachi and all the mess..

what brahmin ancestary is this ,doesnt make sense ??

there traits are similar to mala vedars ( forest inhibited people )

Royal Nasrani said...

So you decided the history according to the view point of todays lens.Thats the mistake.They practised pure vegetarianism and practised untouchability till late 7th century even ,one who were descendeds from namboodiris.Again a namboodiri doing so was termed as "bhrasht" even if he embraced other religion.A brasht has freedom as he is not again in the caste system according to namboodiri...and the so called converted namboodiris gave up their namboodiri norms and rules this was a horizontal deployment that happenned gradually by the "EVANGELIZATION" or the "Eastern Christian" influences later on. I have lots in this topic will post u later.

Royal Nasrani said...

U need to understand the whole sangam era.The southern dynasties,the invasions migrations happened,Varna Influenced period,Nature of kings at that time,Their food pyramid sustainability and so on.This is a mammoth topic.Post u later.

Royal Nasrani said...

"Conversion" itself is parting off from one thing to other.The psychology--- "to get converted psychology" itself is demanding change from the prior.The brahmin or "seers"in that days soceity was a pandit or scholar..from an Aryan race.Conversion is not looking back it was gradual and periodic to have these.Basically because even today the GSBs,Chitpavans eat fish as they could not access any thing more at that time and at that time period they were nomadic in nature due to persecutions ,migrations at last the survival theory applies here.

piscus said...

Sir
I Like to know whether there is any story of anyone who changed to humanity leaving all religiocity. When the world wake upto that level the evilspirits of vice get diffused in the light of love

piscus said...

Sir
Please do something to let the world know about the conversion of humanity from religiocity. Only on that day when the religiocity die the evilspirits of vice diffuse and the saints of love wake up. Till then these witches in cloths swing the sword of hatred among man.

Joshy said...

It looks like some people are fixated with the idea that a place in "Heaven " is guaranteed by claiming that they belong to some organized groups - I mean caste, religion or ethnicity.

There is no proof in history to claim that St Thomas visited India ( Kerala). India, and a coastal Kerala had been a place of trade for ages.

The Kingdoms, and broadminded people in India welcomed most of these people. The main motive was trade. Along with these spiritual ideas mingled.

If you look through history, most of the ideas and inventions had roots in India, including Spirituality.
Spirituality went out of India, and came back to India in different forms.

Who will get converted from their original spirituality at any time in history? They are usually people who are vulnerable, or those who are seeking some form of help.

A lot people may have changed their spiritual ideas from the influence of people who visited Kerala in the early 1st or 2nd century. But main line christianity entered Kerala with the arrival of Portugal traders, and Missionaries from other parts.

Ebby said...

Dear Tharakan Sir, This is well written and enlightening. My views stand as:

In 52 AD if St. Thomas came, he would have been here prior when St. Paul & St. Peter decided to convert Gentiles. Christ had asked the disciples to preach to the twelve tribes of Israel. So St. Thomas, should he have come, would have only preached to the Jews in their Synagogues.

The Kerala Brahmanans are migrants from North India. They arrived here most probably in between the 4th and 9th centuries CE.

The Cross became a Christian symbol only post 200 CE. The symbol associated with the followers of Christ till then was a fish "Ichthys". I am yet to see its reference in the little material that exists on St. Thomas in Kerala. In fact he is referred to as the "Ponnum Kurishu Muthappa" meaning the The Saint of the Golden Cross.

I am a Syrian Christian. No Syrian Christian today will be able to trace an uninterrupted Christian lineage beyond 300 or 400 years.

St. Thomas is being used as a tool in the power struggle among the various groups of Syrian Christians with two churches claiming lineage to his Apostolic Throne!

I hope some of the Syrian Christian would enroll for the genographic project of National Geographic magazine and settle the matter once and for all. It can be found at https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/genographic/lan/en/participate.html

Sachin said...

I hear here Dat many people are claiming dat Brahmins migratd to kerala around 7th o 9th century is totally against the factual history. According to the story presented in Vishnu Purana around 500bc about Brahmins and the formation of kerala is by lord Parushurama who bought out the land from sea what is today goa till kanyakumari. Brahmins bought by him settled down in kerala n other parts much well before the birth of Christ. People should look at te surrounding areas like kasargod which had Brahmins n kings established centuries before the birth of Christ. So thus you May conclude that Brahmins were present in this part of land well before birth of Christ. As far as St Thomas coming to India etc can be seen by the names of cities like chavakkad meaning cursed forest by namboothiri Brahmins because it was polluted by the teachings of a foreigner. There is an inscription also present in the house of certain Brahmin whose family left from chavakkad dating to 52 ad as the time of pollution done by the teachings of a foreigner n so on..still some of te houses of namboothiri Brahmins who were converted hold high position such as high priests is notable.. As far as caste status claimed by anyone it is utterly foolish since in this generation all castes would have had inter caste relations once or de other. N laughable since Syrian Christians are no longer belonging to Hinduism as they used to once. Yet we can't push out the cultural practices followed and traditional influence of Hinduism on Syrian Catholics worship n life.

A.Yeshuratnam said...

Royal Nasrani and Sachin have ignored real facts in history and have relied on mythological stories for the coming of Brahmins. The Brahminical myth proclaims that Parasurama, an Avatar of Mahavishnu, threw his battle axe into the sea. As a result, the land of Kerala arose and was reclaimed from the waters. The Parasurama myth was deliberately propagated by Brahmins only in the 7th century to establish their authority over the divergent people of Kerala who were living in Kerala from pre-historic times. Archaeological excavations reveal the existence of various groups of people in Kerala before the coming of Brahmins. The Parasurama story contradicts its own narration by saying that Parasurama underwent a great penance for having destroyed the Kshatriyas. So Nambudiris were not the first people to occupy Kerala created by Parasurama Moreover the Keralamahatmyam, a Brahmin text which contains the story of Parasurama throwing of his axe for the creation of Kerala was completed only in the 18th century. It was only after the coming of the British and after the establishment of schools and colleges that the Brahmins produced this mythological account to boos their importance. As far as Christians are concerned, the main historical fact to be highlighted is that there were no Brahmins in the Ist century AD when St.Thomas came to Kerala. This can be proved from the fact that only from the 11th century onwards Sanskrit content in Malayalam language could be traced. According to scholars, Nambudiris moved into Kerala in the 8th century and between the 8th and 11th centuries that the Nambudiris gained considerable social ascndancy. These historical evidences set aside the claim that St. Thomas met Nambudiri Brahmins when he came to Kerala in the 1st century.

Sachin said...

Mr yesurathnam is ignorant on the matters of Hindu scripture. I quoted Vishnu purana n matsya purana written well before the birth of Christ. Keralamahatmyam is recognized as consisting of many errors. If u say dat this myth of parashurama was fabricated how do u find many Brahmins o ppl from coastal areas calling this parashurama kshethra before birth of Christ. How do u find many established Sanskrit scholars present in kerala n tulu regions even before Christ.try to compare n facts in and around kerala. Ur statement is devoid of research n full of exaggeration.

Royal Nasrani said...

Mr.Yeshurathnam needs a revision of facts...i think he is poor in history.....
According to Sangam era literary works the Dravidian society was classified into
1.Arivars(non threaded priestly Dravidians).
2.Ulavars/Vellalars/Karalar . or farmers.-Zamindars some local kings
3.Aiyaar or Veduuvar-The shepherds and huntsmen
4.Goldsmith/blacksmith/carpenters/potters .
5.Padaichiar-military armed men.
6.Valayar/pulayar-Fishermen & scavengers.
The first attempt of varna implementation by
Tolkappiyan “a Brahman(thread wearing)” in 1st to 2nd cent B.C mentions the VARNA system as per the Aryans
1.The “threaded pandits Brahmans” were described and not describing the “arivars” or “sages”.
2.The kings Chera,Chola,Pandya and did not mention them as warriors but kings to the second.He also doesnot describe that the kings nor the vaishyas wore the sacred thread.
3.Also Vellalas the cultivators were refered as cultivators not the sudras.Also he states that the ones who are kings should be given the second status as kings. (Some vallalas were local chieftains )
4.The later even he doesnot mention as per the dravidian social heirarchy.(might have found no importance).

This was the first attempt Varna system was tried by a brahman in south as per records n the 2nd to 1st century B.C . THEN HOW COME THE “NO BRAHMAN N CHERA DYNASTY RELEVANT”
When varna …”Introduction-Impressiveness(on kings)-Implementation-execution (it did not happen overnight ,may be it took 2-3 centuries gradually) AND THE FINAL WAS THE NAMBOOTHIRI migration theories.It solidified and credits were to the last solidifiers..the namboothiris.

Please don’t mis understand that my analysis is just to prove the Brahman origins to the nasrani community ….It is a mixed one.
As per Dr Mini Kariappa ..the chitpavans( i know a lot of them from ratnagiri or the konkan areas and have mistaken them to be malayalees,many are my friends and even my senior is a chitpavan ) many now have even accepted islam and has a parallel hindu relatives too,the namboodiris,the syrians have a common ancestory to jews as stated by Dr.Mini Kariappa …
Evidental history has been lost to the Nasranis and many did join the faith at later ages even “before the varna system” …and did marry many “St.Thomas baptized christians” as their was no strictness to the “Varna consciousness” and christian faith did teach about “union”.Many native Dravidian converts (AIVARS -the priestly dravisians),Jews,Aryan priests,Kings were been converted.Each family will have different origins and later on intermixture with each other the pure origins of ones family faded away.

Royal Nasrani said...

Mr.Yeshurathnam....please dont comment emotional...be specific and research....them come top a conclusion...i think u need a better revision of history...

According to Sangam era literary works the Dravidian society was classified into
1.Arivars(non threaded priestly Dravidians).
2.Ulavars/Vellalars/Karalar . or farmers.-Zamindars some local kings
3.Aiyaar or Veduuvar-The shepherds and huntsmen
4.Goldsmith/blacksmith/carpenters/potters .
5.Padaichiar-military armed men.
6.Valayar/pulayar-Fishermen & scavengers.
The first attempt of varna implementation by
Tolkappiyan “a Brahman(thread wearing)” in 1st to 2nd cent B.C mentions the VARNA system as per the Aryans
1.The “threaded pandits Brahmans” were described and not describing the “arivars” or “sages”.
2.The kings Chera,Chola,Pandya and did not mention them as warriors but kings to the second.He also doesnot describe that the kings nor the vaishyas wore the sacred thread.
3.Also Vellalas the cultivators were refered as cultivators not the sudras.Also he states that the ones who are kings should be given the second status as kings. (Some vallalas were local chieftains )
4.The later even he doesnot mention as per the dravidian social heirarchy.(might have found no importance).

This was the first attempt Varna system was tried by a brahman in south as per records n the 2nd to 1st century B.C . THEN HOW COME THE “NO BRAHMAN N CHERA DYNASTY RELEVANT”
When varna …”Introduction-Impressiveness(on kings)-Implementation-execution (it did not happen overnight ,may be it took 2-3 centuries gradually) AND THE FINAL WAS THE NAMBOOTHIRI migration theories.It solidified and credits were to the last solidifiers..the namboothiris.

Please don’t mis understand that my analysis is just to prove the Brahman origins to the nasrani community ….It is a mixed one.
As per Dr Mini Kariappa ..the chitpavans( i know a lot of them from ratnagiri or the konkan areas and have mistaken them to be malayalees,many are my friends and even my senior is a chitpavan ) many now have even accepted islam and has a parallel hindu relatives too,the namboodiris,the syrians have a common ancestory to jews as stated by Dr.Mini Kariappa …
Evidental history has been lost to the Nasranis and many did join the faith at later ages even “before the varna system” …and did marry many “St.Thomas baptized christians” as their was no strictness to the “Varna consciousness” and christian faith did teach about “union”.Many native Dravidian converts (AIVARS -the priestly dravisians),Jews,Aryan priests,Kings were been converted.Each family will have different origins and later on intermixture with each other the pure origins of ones family faded away.

A.Yeshuratnam said...

Part I
According to Syrian Christian tradition St. Thomas came to Kerala in 52 A.D., and converted some Nambudiri Brahmin families such as Kalli, Kaliankara, Sankarapuri, Madapur, Vyampalli, Muttedal, Kottakara, Panakamattom, and Pakalomattom . These names of Nambudiri families are fictitious and cannot be traced in any of the records of Nambudiri Brahmins. Besides, this tradition evolved at a much later date and was not a contemporary account. These fictional names are being maintained to legitimize fanciful claims. Syrian Christian tradition and many other legends found in ancient Christian songs like the Veeradian Pattu, Thomma Parvom, and Margom Kali Pattu, claim conversion of Nambudiri Brahmins by St. Thomas. But all these songs originated after more than thousand years or much later, and not composed in the first century when St.Thomas was in Kerala. Conflicting dates, AD 1601 and AD 1792, assigned to these works give room for suspicion about their authenticity. Even the composer’s name, Ramban Thomas, alleged to be a Nambudiri Brahmin, is highly doubtful as there was no such person in Nambudiri records. The notable document concerning St Thomas is the ‘Acta Thoma’ attributed to a Syrian named Bardasanes , an apocryphal work bearing transparent signs of its Gnostic origin. It was preserved with some modifications in Greek and in Syriac. It also tells about the missionary activities of St. Thomas and his martyrdom. But this work too was of a later origin and different dates are given by scholars, AD 220 or AD 400. According to another Syrian Christian tradition four Nambudiri families of Niranam, Tayyil, Pattamukkil, Manki and Madathilen of Thiruvalla were converted by St.Thomas. But there is no historical evidence about these Nambudiri settlements in Thiruvalla in the 1st century AD. It is probable that some fugitive St Thomas Christians of Mylapore or lower caste converts would have used these fabricated names with the false claim they were Nambudiri converts to avoid persecution by caste-Hindus. None of the Nambudiri records has also any reference to the existence of converted Nambudiri settlements in Thiruvalla in the 1st century AD or the conversion of their community members. Even in the Brahmin tradition found in Keralolpatti there is no reference at all to the conversion of Nambudiris, although it tells about a certain ‘Thomman,’ an opponent of all Vedas’, came to Malabar and ‘converted many prominent people in the land, including the reigning king, Bana Perumal. But Keralolpatti, embellished with myths and legends, was a compilation of 18th century to bolster the superiority and authority of Brahmins in Kerala and not a contemporary narration. It is likely that the Mylapore migrants and local converts, mostly untouchables such as Ezhavas and other outcastes, who moved into Thiruvalla from other areas coined new family names or adopted locality names of Niranam, Tayyil, Pattamukil, Manki and Madathilen and claimed for themselves superior status to hide their past. It must be borne in mind that the converted untouchables and slaves were fleeing from their original places to other areas to escape persecution and punishment. With no Nambudiri or Nayar available for conversion in Thiruvalla and nearby regions, the emergence of a large Syrian population in that region is a clear proof that they were all from lower castes.

A.Yeshuratnam said...

Part II

The claim for the existence of Nambudiri Christian settlements in Thiruvalla was a mixture of fable, hearsay and calculated false propaganda which has made even foreign writers think that it was a fact of history. It is a stark reality that it was due to large scale conversion of untouchables, especially Ezhavas that Christian settlements arose in those areas. Logan points out that the Nambudhiri settlements were mostly in the Calicut, Ernad, Walluvanad and Ponnani taluks of Malabar, and in the Cochin territory in North Travancore. No Nambudiri family of pure birth had settled to the south of the Kollam River in the 1st century AD. Francis Day and Samuel Mateer also affirm that the Travancore Rajas have “in vain tried every means in their power to induce them to reside there.” It is quite improbable, therefore, that Nambudiri settlements existed in Thiruvalla area when St. Thomas or at a later period when Thomas of Cana came to Kerala. Missionary records give us an idea of how new settlements of lower caste and untouchable Christians came into existence in different places and how those converts were tutored to assume for themselves the status of higher castes just to escape persecution by upper caste Hindus. As S.N. Sadasivan, an eminent research scholar who has gone through missionary records, points out: “From the beginning it was the practice of the converts to leave their native village and settle down in a place normally few miles away or as a distant station as possible and to take up avocations other than that of their caste for intelligible reasons. It has enabled them to conceal their past, sever from their close relations and claim a status better than that of their unconverted brethren still struggling to stand up against their neighbouring caste-Hindus, in the new environment they had chosen. The first missionary who understood this social value of this mobility and anonymity was Joseph Peet who always for the safety of his converts from slave caste sent them to other places where they could make new claims and build up a better image for themselves.”

A.Yeshuratnam said...

Part III
Reply to Mr. Sachin & Royal Nasrani

The claim that St.Thomas converted some Nambudiri Brahmins is contrary to historical fact, since there was no Nambudiri population when St.Thomas visited Kerala. Logan says: “The final Brahmin immigration seems to have occurred in or about the eighth century A.D. and Christian colonies had arrived in the country long before that time.” It has also been inferred that the whole of South India, including Kerala, was in the seventh century A.D. under the suzerainty of the Pallavas of Kanchi. As Prof Elamkulam says: “Legend has it that the Apostle St.Thomas landed at Malankara near Kodungallor in the 1st century, established seven churches and converted many including some Nambudiris to the new faith. The Brahmins who later became Nambudiris arrived only in the 7th. and 8th centuries. Many centuries elapsed before the term Nambudiri was evolved.” Without Nambudiri population in Kodungalloor, how could St Thomas convert Nambudiris? In the last phase of Sangam Age, Brahmins started emerging as the elite class and a large number of Brahmin settlements and temples sprang up in several pars of Kerala. As Woodcock says: “During the medieval era, at a period generally thought to lie between the 8th and 11th centuries, the Nambudiri caste of Brahmins established cultural dominance in Kerala, and froze the pattern of communities into an extremely rigid and complicated form. There were no less than five hundred castes and sub-castes, divided from each other by rigorous rules against intermarriage and by an extraordinary pattern of pollution taboos.” It is quite apparent from a retrospective analysis of these events that there was no Nambudiri caste when St.Thomas came to Kerala. Even on the basis of population, there is inherent improbability in the contention that the Syrian Christians are the descendants of Nambudiri converts. During Col. Munro’s time Christians numbered about fifteen percent of the population, whereas Nambudiris amounted to not more than



one percent population of Travancore. As Woodcock says: “To account for this great increase in number and for the spread of the doctrine through almost all the regions which later became the states of Cochin and Travancore, we have to assume a considerable original recruitment from the local population.”

adv.mathew thazhethil jayaraj said...

early Christianity like all churches before the 4th century Nicea sunnahadose were immersed in local and native traditions,

in Chera Kingdom(present south & central kerala) early christianity was a part of vedic vaishnavite belief of Nampthali,the ancient Jewish tribe which gave keno Upanishads to Bharath and was called Nampoothiri in Sanskrit,
it was only Mar Abo who introduced Syrian lytergy in chera kingdom by a royal sanction by chera king Ravi nampoothiri replacing keno upanashid on the backdrop of shivite revival by Adi shankara by the tarish-a-palli sasanam of 825 AD beginning the Malayalam calendar

Royal Nasrani said...

ME2 said...
okey if syrians agree to there brahamin ancestary ,,why do they have a love to eat PORK ,BEEF,cow ,odumb,vedi erachi and all the mess..

what brahmin ancestary is this ,doesnt make sense ??

there traits are similar to mala vedars ( forest inhibited people )

March 10, 2012 12:10 AM


How can u conclude or typecast a section of people that due to eating habits these not having a brahmin ancestry in general even if we take the pre vedic aryan literate classes all were nomadic and what all nomads have i could just giv a guess
.....even chitpavan brahmins ,Goud saraswat brahmins eat fish and to a greater extent chicken ,these eating habits entered at later stages ..one of my friend a daivadnya brahmin even eats beef????? opposing the hindu pantheistic beliefs.In Kottayam near pala many eat pork i never heard in kottayam central,ernakulam ,thiruvallites eating it..its still taboo for a christian a satya kristyani to have pork as it opposes the nasrani laws or the jewish laws...why messing personal likes with the whole community?????

Royal Nasrani said...

Mr.Yeshudasan u r just a "silly googler"....if u can please give referances of namboothiri migration in the 7th to 8th century "only " namboothiri is a malayalam usage for brahmin ...the threaded poonool wearers existed long back to 3rd century B.C before the final settlement even the ebranthiri community has two class differentiation "only differentiated on prior and later settlement" the pisharody section (now ambalavasi or pushpaka brahmin ) had prior buddist ancestry "they were buddist monks later on accomodated in the hindu caste heirarchy ,so your claims are just claims not necessary to be real evidences,so please give us valid referances rather than copying and pasting from google.The syrians even wore the sacred thread and a kudumi (pony tail) only difference is they had a cross in it.Syrians are a mixed community i agree but brahmanical,jewish,rulers and dravidian converts are accomodated in it.That does not proove ur silly claims .Although your propogandist claims are worthless.

കര്‍ണ്ണന്‍ said...

St.Thomas never visited Kerala as per vatican.Vatican says he visited Karachi in Pakistan and died there.Corversion of Nambudhiris by St.Thomas is a myth and not supported by any scientific historical evidence.

The Guide said...

What I gathered from innumerable comments is that the dead caste is still in the minds of many syrian catholics even when Vatican deny the visit of St. Thomas to Kerala. A well written and unbiased article Tharakanji.

In fact it is true that many Nairs and Namboodiris were converted to Christianity in the earli 1 centuary. But what bothers me is that even we Hindus try hard to come out of this caste system why the young geeration of Syrian christians boast of their upper caste lineage??( Eg- Prakash Jose) Shame on Kerala . No wonder why Vivekananda called this state a Lunatic Asylum.

The Guide said...

What I gathered from innumerable comments is that the dead caste is still in the minds of many syrian catholics even when Vatican deny the visit of St. Thomas to Kerala. A well written and unbiased article Tharakanji.

In fact it is true that many Nairs and Namboodiris were converted to Christianity in the earli 1 centuary. But what bothers me is that even we Hindus try hard to come out of this caste system why the young geeration of Syrian christians boast of their upper caste lineage??( Eg- Prakash Jose) Shame on Kerala . No wonder why Vivekananda called this state a Lunatic Asylum.

joseph poonkunnam said...

Hi

My father is a syrian and to my little knowledge i know that even though we are religious he is finding it hard to feed us on a daily basis. if we were the so called landlords and namboothiris of the past , i dont think we will be finding it difficult like this to survive. what i have seen in my father is that he is having a big loving heart but a small pocket. we are happily living even though we are poor but still would like to get the support of the so called landlords and brahmins if they can share their wealth. I know atleast 50 such other poor syrian christians who will be needing the help. Landlords please have the courage to help us by sharing your wealth as if we live like this then it will be an open challenge to your claims.

jow said...

There are certain facts that every one should understand ..
1.There is no historical evidence that ST Thomas came to Kerala.
2. Hinduism started in Kerala at early 8th century only ..before that only Budhists and few Jainists . So even if St thomas really had come to Kerala, he might has converted them.

Phil said...

Interesting article. I guess the general consensus would be that this article is pretty accurate. Regarding the 3 phases of conversion, namely 52AD, 19th and 20th century conversions I have confirmed that my lineage can be traced to 52AD. I have seen my great great grandfather's grave, and he was a christian, buried in Maramon. He would have been born at least around 1870 or so. Hence he was a christian before the conversions started. The main Thirumeni of Marthoma church is my grandfather's first cousin and I am related to another Thirumeni as well. I know this is irrevelant to anyone here, but to me it is very important because I am very proud of my Christian history. I consider myself to be of royal, pure Christian blood..
Cheers everyone

Joshy said...

Well, it looks like people are " possessed " with some sort of egos.
The expressions like " pure blood", " royal christian blood", " upper cast", " lower cast" etc show the egocentric mentality which does not deserve any place in the society.
Please be aware that the world does not care about your egos like these. It is just your mindset only.

There is no proof that St Thomas came to Kerala.

Mainline Christianity came to Kerala in the medieval ages. Some missionary people came in the early century as well.
Conversion to another belief system always involve some sort of force, either silent or vicious.

When a charismatic person approaches someone who is in a vulnerable situation, the most likely chance is that he fall into the charismatic person's spell, and will follow him to the promised imaginary world. People who came on the Ship to the coastal areas of India, introduced Christianity, their culture, science, technology, and also diseases like syphilis, and gonorrhoea which were unknown in the Indian subcontinent.

Human beings evolved out of Africa by chance, and spread to different parts of the world. Those migrations happened several times. There is no scientific evidence of " pure" blood and " impure" blood in humans. You are cousins of apes anyway. If you are born in a Christian family you are labelled by society as a Christian, and so on for other religions. There is no big deal in this.
Poor Jesus Christ, he would have imagined like this.
Amazing mind set of people!!!!



Joshy said...

Correction

-- Poor Jesus Christ, he wouldn't have imagined like this.

UNAIMEDMUSINGS said...

joshy ,
you are already in heavenly utopia,i don't think there is any fault in knowing ones history and speaking about it.

Original Christians said...

Good day sir,

I v some questions..
1.Why all the syrians are boasting about their namboothiri relation as it s a fact that namboothiris landed here only in 700 A D.
2.The no of jews in Israel is seems to be less than Syrian Christians in Kerala.
3.Why all the Syrian Christains are trying to establish that all Latin Christians are converted from Dheewara Community.
4.If at all all syrian christian theories are right can u believe all these massive population include upper castes only.

Original Christians said...

Sir

I know u belong to an old generation of Syrian christian who veinfully trying to establish that you originated from Namboothiri.
There is no evidence that St thomas landed here and if at all landed namboothiris were not here at that time they came only in 7oo A D.
If jewish theory is believed most no of jews are in kerala not in Israel.
All the syrians making hectic efforts to tarnish latin catholics.COme and see the difference in ernakulam.
The fact is that all christians include converted from all classes then why so much hue and cry by Syrian christians.
The truth is that they were karysthans of nairs

Joshy said...

UNAIMEDMUSINGS
Thanks for the comment,
Yes there is no fault in knowing ones history ( correct), and can speak, write, and publish etc as long as it is correct, and evidence based. It is a basic human right.
I am not in any heavenly utopia, I am on the earth.

There are six tombs for St Thomas in India, and six more tombs for St Thomas outside India.i e in Germany, Japan, Brazil, China, Malacca, and in Tibet. Which one is the correct one? I don't know.

John Mathews said...

The Syrian Christians think they are high class but speak a low class south indian language ; malayalam which was derived from Tamil!!!

How high class is that?

The Syrians who have neither fair skin or blue eyes or blond hair etc try their very best to associate themselves with things clean, pure, beautiful but have they looked at themselves in the mirror??

What they see is a dark-skinned, black hair, black/brown eyes looking back at them!! Is that a picture of high class???

The Northern Indians and Whites are laughing at these people who try their very best to elevate themselves but are a laughing stock to all...........

Babu Damodar said...

Many christians proudly says they are converted from Namboodiris. If they are so proud as a Namboodiri, why they converted? All fucking nonsense; I says most of the christians in kerala converted from lower-class communities at that time to escape from the superiority behaviour of so-called upper-class communities. Bloody nonsense. St.Thomas never came to Kerala or India or St.Thomas never converted anybody into christianity. That is the fact ! Stop all these nonsense.

reenarany said...

This is a stupid blog........

shan said...

http://controversiesinhistory.blogspot.in/2012/03/forged-story-of-sole-nair-soildership.html

menokki said...

I dont know why, for all your chest thumping about Christianity, you guys insist on Hindu names. Some even hide their Christian names leaving behind only house names and Hindu names. I suppose you want to be nambuthiri all over again. But I believe it belies your insecurities.

Unknown said...

Pulaya people near our house is converted to Syro malabar church and they turned to Brahmana...
Dhaivasahayam pillai a upper caste fellow converted to lower caste...
Andrepereira, a Portuguese knight's family converted to kerala brahmin..

ridiculous historical rubbish

John Paul said...

Objective Kerala Christian writes.

Obviously Mr.Tharakan, like many other vain and snobbish Syrian Christians like him, claims Nampoothiri (Brahmin) origins with ulterior motives. This could be part of the common attempt by many Syrian Christians to seek respectability and esteem in Kerala society which till recently was obsessed with caste and practiced caste based social discrimination and oppression to the level of 'lunacy' as Swamy Vivekananda noted.Till the 19th century, lower castes were not allowed to seek education, dress well,use some public roads or build decent dwellings and till a few decades ago a person's caste had to be declared to the authorities before he availed of any public service (even for as insignificant a purpose as purchasing a ticket for public transport)so that the authorities could decide if they were eligible for it. Kerala's was a society that practiced 'apartheid' long before it came into existence in erstwhile South Africa. Under conditions of severe discrimination and inhuman oppression as imposed and practiced by the rulers and powers that be in Kerala in those days, being born into the upper castes bestowed plenty of otherwise undeserved privilege on a person and being born into a lower caste brought about misery for life. Under such conditions, it was in the interest of any smart individual, or community for that matter, to claim upper caste (and Brahmin to boot) inclusion or origins.It is similar to the practice that used to be followed by some astute blacks in the pre-civil rights era USA ie., 'passing off' themselves as whites (if their skin pigmentation permitted)to overcome the discrimination they were sure to face otherwise( if the reader is interested, have a google search for 'passing off' in the USA). It is fair to assume that it was this wish that motivated Mr.Tharakan's forbears (and now Mr.Tharakan himself) to claim Brahmin ancestry

John Paul said...

It is very clear to any intelligent and reasonably informed person that the Syrian Christians, like any other community in Kerala, are a heterogeneous group with plenty of admixture. They are, invariably, a mish-mash of the highest and lowest castes and tribals (Arundhati Roy, in her novel 'God of small things' had the honesty to admit that a line of her family traced its ancestry to Dalits- to the shame of her uncles!). At best,Syrian Christians are half-castes descended from West Asian merchants (Jews, Phoenicians,Romans, Persians,Arabs etc.)who visited Kerala shores from time immemorial and women of Kerala origin (mostly from lower castes - since the powerful classes, as is the practice even now, never gave their women in marriage to strangers). The Muslim 'Moppilas' of Malabar have no problem accepting this fact because Muslims, having been rulers of India for nearly a thousand years never had to face any discrimination from caste Hindus. Also,Muslim religious leaders, unlike Syrian Christian priests and Bishops, generally discourage caste, race or ethnic consciousness among their folk.Not so with Syrian Christian 'mappilas'(mappila stands for son-in-law in Tamil and Malayalam too).As pointed out by many here, till recently, the vast majority of them were at the level of serfs and peasants living off the mercy of the feudal rulers and landed gentry of Kerala as subalterns to them (with hard work, no doubt).Getting early access to modern education, thanks to the British missionaries, they found themselves in the professions and businesses much earlier than even many upper caste Hindus and the one thing to secure acceptance and social respectability in the prevailing feudal milieu was a claim to ancestry high enough in the social hierarchy; and here comes handy the fiction of Brahmin conversion et al as invented in the 16th century by the vested interests among their clergy and helped in its propagation by the Portuguese who reached Kerala then and their Religious masters in the hierarchy of the day in Rome(of course with the intention to grind their own religious axes in India).So much for Mr.Tharakan's brahmin ancestry claim!

John Paul said...

Now, the time has arrived to corroborate this. Mr.Tharakan can approach any laboratory and check his DNA for ancestry. (Such labs have become common in the USA and shortly will become common in India too.) Ti is certain that his mitochondrial DNA will point towards Kerala lower caste ( and by extension proto-australoid !) maternal lineage and his Y-chromosome could have its needle turned towards west Asia. Mr.Tharakan need not be worried for being a descendant of immigrants. Renowned geneticist Spencer Wells says that most south Indians have the same maternal lineage and the Y-chromosomes of most of us (including Brahmins and Pariahs) come from Central Asia if not West Asia. So Mr.Tharakan is not alone!And if we stretch our history back to the 'out of Africa Theory' the maternal and paternal ancestors of all of us humans (Africans, Europeans,Americans, Indians,Chinese, Japanese, Australian aborigines, West Asians - and of course for Mr.Tharakan,s satisfaction focused as he is in caste, Nampoothiri Brahmins,other sundry Brahnmins, Nairs, Ezhavas Pariahs, Pulayas, Syrian Christians,and every other human being alive today), the genetic Adam and Eve lived in Africa only as recently as between 50,000 and 100,000 years. So much for your Brahmin blood Mr.Tharakan.

Joshy said...

Hi John Paul
Well done.

People should learn genetics, and evolutionary biology, and also about Chromosome number 2.
The wave of migration happened several times in India ( Kerala as well), from about 50, 000 - 70,000 years ago.
Genetics is evidence based science.

Krishna said...

Utter foolishnes mr.prakash.if you are sure u r an upper caste,please go for a DNA analysis.

sajeevan said...

കേരളത്തിലെ ലത്തീൻ സഭയെക്കുറിച്ച് നിങ്ങൾക്ക് എന്തെല്ലാം അറിയാം? ആ അറിവുകൾ പൂർണമായും ശരിയാണെന്ന ആത്മവിശ്വാസം നിങ്ങൾക്കുണ്ടോ? എങ്കിൽ പറയൂ, ആരാണ് കേരളത്തിലെ യഥാർത്ഥ റോമൻ കത്തോലിക്കർ?

സിറിയൻ കത്തോലിക്കർ എന്നറിയപ്പെടുന്ന സീറോ മലബാർ സഭ എന്നു പറയാൻ ഒരുങ്ങുകയാണെങ്കിൽ തെറ്റി. കാരണം, സീറോ മലബാർ സഭ പിന്തുടരുന്നത് റോമൻ സഭയുടെ ഔദ്യോഗിക ആരാധനക്രമമായ ലത്തീൻ റീത്തല്ല, പൗരസ്ത്യ ആരാധനക്രമമാണ്. ഇപ്പോൾ മനസ്സിലായില്ലേ കേരളത്തിലെ ലത്തീൻ സഭയെക്കുറിച്ച് പലരുടെയും അറിവ് പൂർണമല്ലെന്ന്.

അതെ, കേരളത്തിലെ യഥാർത്ഥ റോമൻ കത്തോലിക്കൻ ലത്തീൻ ആരാധനക്രമം പിന്തുടരുന്നവർതന്നെ. (ഫ്രാൻസിസ് പാപ്പ തലവനായ റോമൻ കത്തോലിക്കാസഭയുടെ ഭാഗമായ 22 പൗരസ്ത്യസഭകളിൽ ഒന്നുമാത്രമാണ് സീറോ മലബാർ സഭ. സീറോ മലങ്കര സഭയാണ് കേരളത്തിലുള്ള മറ്റൊരു പൗരസ്ത്യ റീത്ത്.)

കേരളത്തിലെ ലത്തീൻ സഭയെക്കുറിച്ച് കൂടുതൽ അറിയാൻ വൈബ് സെറ്റ് സന്ദർശിക്കു (http://latincatholickerala.org/2013-03-26-16-09-29/history.html). മാത്രമല്ല, ഇത് കൂടുതൽ പേരിലേക്ക് എത്തിക്കാൻ ഇത് ഷെയർ ചെയ്യുകയുംവേണം.

https://www.facebook.com/catholickerala

St.Thomas said...

abc

St.Thomas said...

In this article, Mr.Tharakan labouriously tries to say that the syrian christians are descendants of Namoothiris converted by St. THomas in 52AD. But in his another article"Kerala Brahmins-Moving with the times", he gives a thousand year history to Namboothiris in Kerala. You are a fraud. You make stories to suit your bad intentions, to cover up your and your community's real and stupid identity.

St.Thomas said...

It is funny to say that St. Thomas visited Kerala(in fact he had never visited Kerala)having orders from Jesus Christ to convert only upper caste Namboothiris.(History says that the Namboothiri migration to Kerala started in the eighth centuary AD and flourished here by tenth centuary.) Jesus Christ asked the Apostles to" go and make disciples of all the nations" irrespective of their caste or community.Ref.Mathew 28:19,20 Mark 16:15 Luke 24:47

At the time of Jesus and after his cruzifixion, his followers were treated as outcasts in their own country and faced lot of atrocities. The Apostles fled away from Jesus to save their lives. The status of His followers was very bad; Acts of Apostles 9:1,2. The status of St.Thomas was not different. The same Outcast St.Thomas when reached the shores of Kerala suddenly became the Envoy/Ambassador of his country obviously without any official letters from the ruler of his mother country! WHAT NONSENSE? And if so, for arguement, why didnt the Portugese and the British get such privilege? Was there no upper caste educated Brahmins at that time? Mr.Tharakan, there should be some limit for your wild and foolish imaginations. I think you are not a fool but pretend to be a fool to write such rubbish to suit your intentions. Can you show one in five hundred Nair coverts or one in five thousand Brahmin coverts in the last seventy years. The Brahmins and Nairs are proud of their identity. It is you and the so called Syrian Christian community try to borrow a fake address from the upper castes. I say with full confidence that 99.99PERCENT OF SYRIAN CHRISTIANS ARE CONVERTED FROM LOWEST OF LOWER CLASSES as is the case of present day. And you are one of them. That is all Mr.Tharakan. I will come back with the next episode very soon, Mr.Tharakan. Till then Good Night.

Anand said...

Dont be so curious on syrians social status.just observe the culture they are following and try to feel their royalty in appearance and thoughts.i can tell history of my family history..basically i belongs to kuravilangadu at kottayam.my ancistors were belongs to shankarapuri mahakudumbam.then this huge family splits and known as nambissery kudumbam..again it splits.one of the family among nambissery is manthottathil.i belongs to this family.we migrated from kottayam to malabar for land invention and doubling assets.we were aimed to do agriculture because we are christians need to eat food from land by hardwork.this is a huge traditional concepts of my ancistors because we are not able to do pooja like brahmins.after reached malabar we came to know that one nair janmi handling huge hectares of land and lowercaste peoples are working like donkeys.but these low caste poeples were not being wealthy after their hardworking also.they are the slaves of this nair janmi physically and mentally.we came from kottayam with money tht handled by ancistors in kuravilangadu.we brought acres of land from janmi for some less amount.eg. 1acre land for 60ruppees like that.in some areas janmi given kudikidappavakaasam.he may thought we also were like his slaves.after some years we the migrated peoples of kottayam became landlords by the foolish law like kudikidappavakaasam by janmi.finally janmi became ab ordinary landlord like us.old slaves of janmi are now also as like brfore.they are backwards financially also.just correlate with your knowledge and put the logic.

Anand said...

Hello mr.st.thomas, i belongs to a syrian christian family.kindly put your mind to some logical conversations,not with me but with ur mind or soul.every humans soul is divine.so,firstly think about the concept of caste.how the caste system would have been implemented.it is sure to my logic that each and every upper caste humans in kerala should have a gentle look,high level thinking,better culture,great appearance,mind exposure towards the new concepts,respectful mind towards orthodox concepts etc..it is fact that,we are not able to find a person with all above mentioned quality.but we can find the person with some of the above mentioned qualities.fortunately or not,it is helpful to search such people in upper class communities.not meant tht no lower caste person having such qualities.but here majority plays a big role for our findings.so mr.St.Thomas,you can now find such persons.kindly refer namboodhiris,kshatriyas,nairs,syrians etc...this would easy for find the upper caste culture of syrian christians.i feel shame on my brother syrians who put arguments for their brahmin and jews connection.even i also heard this brahmin heredity of my ancistors from childhood onwards.but not a single person in my family who are proud on their brahmin connections.but in me we are curious abt the history atleast our family's.so kindly go and read bible for finding the thoughts of Jesus Christ.I am really proud to be a member of church that built on the rock.

Anand said...

Hello mr.st.thomas, i belongs to a syrian christian family.kindly put your mind to some logical conversations,not with me but with ur mind or soul.every humans soul is divine.so,firstly think about the concept of caste.how the caste system would have been implemented.it is sure to my logic that each and every upper caste humans in kerala should have a gentle look,high level thinking,better culture,great appearance,mind exposure towards the new concepts,respectful mind towards orthodox concepts etc..it is fact that,we are not able to find a person with all above mentioned quality.but we can find the person with some of the above mentioned qualities.fortunately or not,it is helpful to search such people in upper class communities.not meant tht no lower caste person having such qualities.but here majority plays a big role for our findings.so mr.St.Thomas,you can now find such persons.kindly refer namboodhiris,kshatriyas,nairs,syrians etc...this would easy for find the upper caste culture of syrian christians.i feel shame on my brother syrians who put arguments for their brahmin and jews connection.even i also heard this brahmin heredity of my ancistors from childhood onwards.but not a single person in my family who are proud on their brahmin connections.but in me we are curious abt the history atleast our family's.so kindly go and read bible for finding the thoughts of Jesus Christ.I am really proud to be a member of church that built on the rock.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

St. Thomas visited Kerala and introduced Christianity .After St. Thomas other missionaries from Persia came to Kerala and converted many people.. The early converts in Kerala belonging to different grades in society on the basis of occupation were commonly called Christians But the name Christian was changed to Nasrani when the Arabs (Moplahs) came to Kerala. Muslims used the word Nasrani in a contemptuous and derogatory manner. Christians and Jews were hated by Muslims in the Middle East and so they used the word 'Nasrani' in a derogatory and spiteful manner, as the Greeks called others 'barbarians.' Muslims quote the Koran to call Christians and Jews as 'Nasranis.'
This is the basis of the verse. " Jews say: 'Uzair is the son of God' and the Christians say: 'The Messiah, son of God'. Such is their saying with their mouths; they imitate the infidels saying earlier. Allah has cursed them, how are they to turn? "(Surat al-Tawbah: 30) By this interpretation, Muslims regard Christians and Jews infidels and collectively call them ‘Nasrani.’
Even today all Christians are contemptuously called Nasranis in the Middle East by the Arabs. In Kerala also, after the Arabs gave the derogatory name 'Nasranis' to Christians, Brahmins and Nairs also used that word in a derogatory and insulting manner till the arrival of colonial powers. Vrahnins and Nairs made Christians work as coolies, agricultural labourers in their farmlands and compulsory service called ‘oozhiyam.’ The true economic and social condition of the Christians who were ridiculously called Nasranis was recorded by a missionary when European powers were slowly establishing their authority; Abbe J.A. Dubois, a missionary in Mysore, in his letter dated August 7, 1815, writes: “The Jesuits, on their first arrival in India, hearing of them, in one way or other converted the greatest part to the Catholic faith. Their liturgy is to this day in the Syrian language, and in the performance of their religious ceremonies they use this ancient dead tongue. There remains still among them large congregations, consisting of 70 or 80,000 Christians, of whom two-thirds are Catholics, and a third Nestorians. They are all designated under the contemptuous name of Nazarany, and held by the pagans in still greater contempt than the Christians of this part of the country. The Nairs chiefly keep them at a greatest distance, and they form a separate caste.” Muslim immigrants (Moplahs) contrmptuously called Christians Nasranis whose staple food at that time was kuppa and fish, not rice.
(to be continued).

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

(continued from previous post)
St. Thomas visited Kerala and i
When the Portuguese and the British educated these hapless Christians and appointed them as soldiers, businessmen and planters, Christians ascended to top position in the fields of education, business, plantations, and commerce making Brahmins and Nairs inferiors. The Portuguese were in Kerala for 150 years and during this period there was widespread inter racial marriage between Portuguese and local Hindus. Albuquerque officially encouraged such marriages to increase Christian population. Later the offspring of such marriages married local Christians which eventually led to change in skin color and personality. Gradually the contemptuous name Nasrani was given up and the words, ‘Christians’ and ‘Syrian Christians’ became common usage. But in Arab countries Christians are even today called in a vulgar form, ‘Nasranis.” In a recent riot in Cairo when Muslim fanatics attacked Christians, the Huffington Post dated August 17, 2013 reported the following incident
“Naguib’s home supplies store on a main commercial street in the provincial capital, also called Minya, was torched this week and the flames consumed everything inside.
"A neighbor called me and said the store was on fire. When I arrived, three extremists with knifes approached me menacingly when they realized I was the owner," recounted Naguib. His father and brother pleaded with the men to spare him. Luckily, he said, someone shouted that a Christian boy was filming the proceedings using his cell phone, so the crowd rushed toward the boy shouting "Nusrani, Nusrani," the Quranic word for Christians which has become a derogatory way of referring to them in today's Egypt.”

John Paul said...

This is in reply to Anand’s posting of 27th August.
First, some definitions.

RACISM : Belief in the superiority of a particular race. Prejudice based on this
-Oxford English Dictionary

CASTE : “ Caste is an aspect of race”.
-as defined under Section 9(5) of Equality Act 2010 passed by British Parliament recently.

Equality Act was enacted specifically to treat people belonging to all races and castes (including ethnic Indians) in Britain as equals under all conditions and contexts of the socio-political environment as existing in British society today and to wipe out racial/casteist prejudices, express or implied, and was thus intended as a means to eradicate racial or casteist bigotry and prejudice in the minds of ordinary people.
Thus, if we go by this definition of Caste as given in the law in the UK and consider the definition of Racism as given in the Oxford English Dictionary,

CASTEISM = Belief in the superiority of a particular caste. Prejudice based on this.

Anand proves himself to be a prejudiced bigot and hardened casteist with an abhorrently ugly mind, very much in tune with the narrow and petty mindsets of some Syrian Christians, many of whom belonged to or still belong to the semi literate lower middle class sections of Kerala society (eg. marginal farmers with small land holdings of rubber, spices, bananas etc., who labour themselves in their little plots or keep cows, chicken or piggeries to earn a living , shop keepers, Primary school teachers, peons, clerks, nurses, technicians working in the Persian Gulf etc.) who are slowly acquiring wealth and education and are in the process of social climbing corresponding to such new wealth and thus need psychological props like loud claims about their community belonging to the upper castes etc., in order to forget their wretched existence of the past or to boost their low self esteem resulting from present day deprivation.
Anand writes as follows: “Observe the culture they (Syrian Christians) are following and try to feel (sic) their royalty in appearance and thoughts”!!
Royalty is the state of being a King or Queen and Royalty is ascribed only to Kings, Queens or their children. None else is called ‘Royal’. Here, Anand confers royalty on all Syrian Christians!! Not just ‘royalty’, but ‘royalty in appearance and thoughts’. Ridiculous words! Anand makes these silly statements only because types like him (being in plenty among Syrian Christians) are still wallowing in semi-literacy, unable to see the world as it is or distinguish between meanings of common words or ideas.

John Paul said...

This is in reply to Anand’s posting of 27th August.

First, some definitions.

RACISM : Belief in the superiority of a particular race. Prejudice based on this
-Oxford English Dictionary

CASTE : “ Caste is an aspect of race”.
-as defined under Section 9(5) of Equality Act 2010 passed by British Parliament recently.

Equality Act was enacted specifically to treat people belonging to all races and castes (including ethnic Indians) in Britain as equals under all conditions and contexts of the socio-political environment as existing in British society today and to wipe out racial/casteist prejudices, express or implied, and was thus intended as a means to eradicate racial or casteist bigotry and prejudice in the minds of ordinary people.
Thus, if we go by this definition of Caste as given in the law in the UK and consider the definition of Racism as given in the Oxford English Dictionary,

CASTEISM = Belief in the superiority of a particular caste. Prejudice based on this.

Anand proves himself to be a prejudiced bigot and hardened casteist with an abhorrently ugly mind, very much in tune with the narrow and petty mindsets of some Syrian Christians, many of whom belonged to or still belong to the semi literate lower middle class sections of Kerala society (eg. marginal farmers with small land holdings of rubber, spices, bananas etc., who labour themselves in their little plots or keep cows, chicken or piggeries to earn a living , shop keepers, Primary school teachers, peons, clerks, nurses, technicians working in the Persian Gulf etc.) who are slowly acquiring wealth and education and are in the process of social climbing corresponding to such new wealth and thus need psychological props like loud claims about their community belonging to the upper castes etc., in order to forget their wretched existence of the past or to boost their low self esteem resulting from present day deprivation.
Anand writes as follows: “Observe the culture they (Syrian Christians) are following and try to feel (sic) their royalty in appearance and thoughts”!!
Royalty is the state of being a King or Queen and Royalty is ascribed only to Kings, Queens or their children. None else is called ‘Royal’. Here, Anand confers royalty on all Syrian Christians!! Not just ‘royalty’, but ‘royalty in appearance and thoughts’. Ridiculous words! Anand makes these silly statements only because types like him (being in plenty among Syrian Christians) are still wallowing in semi-literacy, unable to see the world as it is or distinguish between meanings of common words or ideas.

John Paul said...

And what is so special about the appearance of Syrian Christians and what greatness do they have in thought? How many Miss. Indias or Mr.Indias have come from among them? Many of them have only the typical looks of the half-caste breed that they are (a mixture of Semitic, Persian and Southern Indian features with dark to dull cream complexion) though the bulk of them look no different from other Keralites of all castes. If Anand means that they have handsome features then he himself proves by expressing his casteist thinking here that Syrian Christian types like him have equally ugly and despicable minds. If they are so great in thought, well, how many Nobel laureates have they produced? Most Syrian Christians are average achievers or under-achievers in academics or the Businesses or the Professions. There could be some brilliant or successful people among them here and there, but so is the case with every other community in Kerala, whether of the forward castes or other backward castes. Only Scheduled castes and Tribals are still lagging in indicators of social development, but they too will catch up very soon. No Syrian Christian Literary figure, poet or author comes anywhere near the great poets or other literary Giants of Kerala. No great scientist , no great artist, not even an acclaimed big-businessman has been produced by the community even though as a group their primary concern in life is the pursuit of mammon ie., the quest for money-making and enjoying the resultant life comforts. That is why the newly moneyed middle classes among them build huge mansions among the bushes and thickets of their godforsaken villages with their Gulf earnings and buy fancy cars and park them inside their gates to show off. Many among them entered politics to secure the economic interests of the community and so there are plenty of politicians of every hue among them and, as is well known, the Kerala Congress Party itself was formed for this purpose. Now, they even want to build an airport in the marshes of Aranmula with the money earned in the West, which will result in the destruction of agricultural land and desecration of the holy places of the local folk. If built, this airport will be far away from nowhere, having no use to anyone but the Syrian Christians of the rural and thinly populated areas of Pathanamthitta District. This airport will be a symbol of the pathological vanity that afflicts many Syrian Christians.
Syrian Christian contribution to the intellectual discourse, the renaissance and reformation of Kerala society is at best marginal. With minds still mired in the decadence and darkness of the feudal past of Kerala (when they earned a living by being loyal share-cropper serfs of their land owning feudal masters) they are incapable of appreciating the great changes that have taken place in Kerala society. This is because the really gifted, socially concerned, intellectually honest, thinking and upright ones among them are so few. Almost all the rest of the supposedly educated and elite ones among them are either moral imposters or self seekers whose social vision is limited to the context of their community interests or church interests. Whatever piety or prayers that come from them are intended for their own well being and not for the well being of outsiders or society at large They are surreptitiously living as a nation within a nation with no care or concern for the people outside of their community, though they have no problem stooping and groveling before the rich and powerful ones among such outsiders.
What culture can be observed in such selfish people? Alas Anand, it is the culture of arrogance, snobbery, greed and depravity that we observe in you and many of your fellow Syrian Christians.

John Paul said...

And what is so special about the appearance of Syrian Christians and what greatness do they have in thought? How many Miss. Indias or Mr.Indias have come from among them? Many of them have only the typical looks of the half-caste breed that they are (a mixture of Semitic, Persian and Southern Indian features with dark to dull cream complexion) though the bulk of them look no different from other Keralites of all castes. If Anand means that they have handsome features then he himself proves by expressing his casteist thinking here that Syrian Christian types like him have equally ugly and despicable minds. If they are so great in thought, well, how many Nobel laureates have they produced? Most Syrian Christians are average achievers or under-achievers in academics or the Businesses or the Professions. There could be some brilliant or successful people among them here and there, but so is the case with every other community in Kerala, whether of the forward castes or other backward castes. Only Scheduled castes and Tribals are still lagging in indicators of social development, but they too will catch up very soon. No Syrian Christian Literary figure, poet or author comes anywhere near the great poets or other literary Giants of Kerala. No great scientist , no great artist, not even an acclaimed big-businessman has been produced by the community even though as a group their primary concern in life is the pursuit of mammon ie., the quest for money-making and enjoying the resultant life comforts. That is why the newly moneyed middle classes among them build huge mansions among the bushes and thickets of their godforsaken villages with their Gulf earnings and buy fancy cars and park them inside their gates to show off. Many among them entered politics to secure the economic interests of the community and so there are plenty of politicians of every hue among them and, as is well known, the Kerala Congress Party itself was formed for this purpose. Now, they even want to build an airport in the marshes of Aranmula with the money earned in the West, which will result in the destruction of agricultural land and desecration of the holy places of the local folk. If built, this airport will be far away from nowhere, having no use to anyone but the Syrian Christians of the rural and thinly populated areas of Pathanamthitta District. This airport will be a symbol of the pathological vanity that afflicts many Syrian Christians.
Syrian Christian contribution to the intellectual discourse, the renaissance and reformation of Kerala society is at best marginal. With minds still mired in the decadence and darkness of the feudal past of Kerala (when they earned a living by being loyal share-cropper serfs of their land owning feudal masters) they are incapable of appreciating the great changes that have taken place in Kerala society. This is because the really gifted, socially concerned, intellectually honest, thinking and upright ones among them are so few. Almost all the rest of the supposedly educated and elite ones among them are either moral imposters or self seekers whose social vision is limited to the context of their community interests or church interests. Whatever piety or prayers that come from them are intended for their own well being and not for the well being of outsiders or society at large They are surreptitiously living as a nation within a nation with no care or concern for the people outside of their community, though they have no problem stooping and groveling before the rich and powerful ones among such outsiders.
What culture can be observed in such selfish people? Alas Anand, it is the culture of arrogance, snobbery, greed and depravity that we observe in you and many of your fellow Syrian Christians.

John Paul said...

Casteist notions held by many of the Syrian Christians show the condemnably anachronistic outlook the community still carries in this 21st century. As Anand admits, right from infancy, Syrian Christian parents indoctrinate and spoon feed their children the poisonous notion of superiority of their community (which they funnily claim as of Nampoothiri Brahmin origin without any basis to prove it) as against the lower castes among Hindus and Christian converts. This sense of perceived superiority is professed by the likes of Anand when the Brahmins and other upper caste Hindus of Kerala have long shed their caste consciousness and are no more concerned about caste in their social life other than for purposes like marriage etc.
Anand writes on; “it is sure to my logic that each and every upper caste humans in Kerala should have a gentle look, high level thinking, better culture, great appearance …..……you can now find such persons….namboodhiris, kshatriyas, nairs, Syrians etc…..” and blah blah blah (may be he finds upper caste animals too in Kerala).
Even as he says that persons with the above supposedly exemplary qualities could be found among the above castes (curiously Syrian Christians come last in Anand’s list just as the Sudras of the Chaturvarnya system), he implies that the bulk of the lower castes do not have such qualities and includes “respectful mind towards orthodox concepts’ among the good qualities an upper caste person needs.
These are an unschooled man’s restatement of the Manusmriti. Anand could have unknowingly picked up these injunctions of Manu from his Syrian Christian elders or church leaders.

John Paul said...

The sad side of these sordid misconceptions of an ignorant person like Anand is that he does not realize that his community has its roots in the base population of Kerala ie., the Dalits and other lower castes. Syrian Christians who are otherwise known as ‘Nazrani Mappilas’ as against the ‘Arabi Mappilas’ of Malabar, are the progeny of seafarer-merchants from ancient Arabia, Iraq and Iran in miscegenation/cohabitation with the lower caste women of Kerala. The muslim ‘Arabi Mappilas’ know and admit that their community was spawned by Arab merchants who came to the Malabar coast from the 9th century AD onwards. The Arabs still come and take brides, use and then discard them. The recent story of the orphan muslim girl of Calicut who underwent ‘Arabi kalyanam’ only to be used and thrown in a matter of weeks by her Arab groom is still hogging the headlines in the media. Most surprisingly, Syrian Christians are not aware of their origins since they were misled during the Middle Ages to believe and profess that they were Brahmin converts in order to escape discrimination and oppression at the hands of the feudal upper caste Hindus because they never had the military acumen of the Arabi Mappilas to force their way in society. So they adopted the tactic of deception and the later generations considered this as their true history. The intermittently appearing fair(wheatish) complexion and sharp features of the Syrian Christian ‘Nazrani Mappilas’ which Anand calls ‘ Royalty in appearance’ come from their Arab/ Iraqi/Iranian forefathers and the intermittent dark complexion and rotund features come from their Dalit , Tribal and backward caste ‘foremothers’. If Anand conducts a DNA check for ancestry his Dalit roots will easily be proved.
Now, back to the British law mentioned earlier ie., ‘The Equality Act’ . This Act was formulated by the enlightened law makers and civil society in Britain just to protect the likes of Anand ( ie.,Indians, Blacks etc.) from the prejudice and contempt of the White British bigots of Anand’s kind. Had Anand been living in England with his swarthy skin and semi literate background, he stood the chance of being subjected to racial hatred and ridicule by the racist Whites since many Indians in Britain command only as much acceptance and status in the White society of Britain as Dalits command among bigots and casteists like Anand in Kerala.
It is fortunate for Anand that he lives in Kerala, for he can now boast of his ‘Royalty in appearance and thought’ and get away with it.

St.Thomas said...

In reply to Anands 27th sept. post:
St. Thomas converted 32 Brahmin families(some say it is 16,12,8 so on). Is there any Brahmin family of the same name existing today? Were they evaporated into air?. There is no Brahmin family history of first century AD available today. However the Syrian Christians are wise enough to extract the root of their ancestry from the non existent Brahmins community of 1st century AD.

Most likely, the origin of Syrian Christians may be as listed below:

1.The illegal byproducts of Arab/Jewish traders with local lower caste women. These powerful traders with enough money used these poor women for enjoyment and entertainment.

2.The missionaries who came along with west Asian traders converted lower caste people to Christianity using money or some other manipulations. The upper caste people like Brahmins or Nairs were powerful and proud of their caste. The missionaries could not get them as is the case of today.

The newly formed/converted people thus became a separate caste. The upper caste Hindu landlords became furious towards them for obvious reasons. They began to fuck them from front and back without any mercy. Instead of getting their daily bread from the Hindu landlords, they began to get kicks in their ass. Thus these Christians fled away from their native places to places like Kuravilangad(Kuravans were the early inhabitants-thus the place name) and hilly area of Kottayam,Pathanamthitta,Idukki etc. These migratory birds could achieve some good things by their migration. They could conceal their real and ugly identity. Here they declared their Brahmin identity. They encroached large measures of government land. there they worked as donkeys(the real Brahmin heredity?) and attained wealth. The rest is history.

St.Thomas said...

In reply to Anands 27th sept. post:
St. Thomas converted 32 Brahmin families(some say it is 16,12,8 so on). Is there any Brahmin family of the same name existing today? Were they evaporated into air?. There is no Brahmin family history of first century AD available today. However the Syrian Christians are wise enough to extract the root of their ancestry from the non existent Brahmins community of 1st century AD.

Most likely, the origin of Syrian Christians may be as listed below:

1.The illegal byproducts of Arab/Jewish traders with local lower caste women. These powerful traders with enough money used these poor women for enjoyment and entertainment.

2.The missionaries who came along with west Asian traders converted lower caste people to Christianity using money or some other manipulations. The upper caste people like Brahmins or Nairs were powerful and proud of their caste. The missionaries could not get them as is the case of today.

The newly formed/converted people thus became a separate caste. The upper caste Hindu landlords became furious towards them for obvious reasons. They began to fuck them from front and back without any mercy. Instead of getting their daily bread from the Hindu landlords, they began to get kicks in their ass. Thus these Christians fled away from their native places to places like Kuravilangad(Kuravans were the early inhabitants-thus the place name) and hilly area of Kottayam,Pathanamthitta,Idukki etc. These migratory birds could achieve some good things by their migration. They could conceal their real and ugly identity. Here they declared their Brahmin identity. They encroached large measures of government land. there they worked as donkeys(the real Brahmin heredity?) and attained wealth. The rest is history.

Darshan said...

attention.the above poster 'st.Thomas' is a srilankan ltte Tamil terrorist currently residing in Australia.he is an anti Malayali,Christian,Indian.

St.Thomas said...

I have nothing to do with the above said St.Thomas

St.Thomas said...

I have nothing to do with the above said St.Thomas

St.Thomas said...

The above said St. Thomas,I mean, the above said Darsan himself.

Pulikeel said...

What a work! ( Just the volume- It took so much time for me to glance through). I understand :
1. Racism and Caste-ism are states of mind. Discrimination based on birth of a person is sin against God and man
2. people are brainwashed to think that superiority/ inferiority exists based on colour/ caste etc. This is totally wrong. God has created men and women as equals. and it is said in the Bible.
3. I am born in a Syrian Christian family. But I condemn those who work so hard to claim that they are converts from the "Upper castes" Some are not even satisfied by "Uppercaste" they want to emphasis "Brahmins". Shame on you . You can not prove it. And even if you prove what good is it. Are you followers of Christ or descendants of Brahmins? Which is important? If you are Christian first accept that Jesus' message is for the entire mankind. He showed by example that discrimination is wrong by going to the Samaritan Lady. The "Upper castes/ elite" blamed him for gong with sinners/ tax collectors etc. He did not mind. He said just to follow one Kalpana. "Love one another as I loved you". He said that those who work for peace will be called sons of God. A teacher who loved ALL mankind' Who forgave and prayed for those who were killing him EVEN without their repentance or asking, who never established a religion! A Guru who never said with his mouth "I am son of God" but always referred to himself as "son of MAN"; but his deeds made others declare that "you are son of GOD"; who established the rules for ancestry " My mother and brothers are those who do my fathers will".If you can not take pride in saying that you belong to His family but do all you can to establish that you are sons and daughters of "Brahmins" I can only sympathize and pray for you. Thamaso Ma Jyothirgamaya
Kuriakose kpoetv@yahoo.com

roypjohn said...

i have been scrolling through the various comments and i would like to state the following.
as per the latest research based on human dna our ancestors are from africa. from there around 70- 60,000 years back they migrated and spread to various parts of the world. this group numbered only in the 100's.
the majority indians have predominantly two basic set of dna's ie ancestral south indian (asi) and ancestral north indian (ani) with a mixture of other strains. this was during the period approximation 1900- 4200 years back, which means that there was free mixture within the subcontinent during the above period.
the arrival of the dravidians is presumed to be 700 bc and and that of aryans around 300 bc.
the settlement of brahmins in kerala into villages was in the region of 600 ad. christianity reached kerala around 50 ad.
skin pigmentation which for us makes for caste connotations is a natural reaction of the skin to ultra violet radiation from sunlight.
moreover according to one study all of manking living today is related to one man of the distant past. this is what the study of dna has told us.
i hope the above helps.

roypjohn said...

i have been scrolling through the various comments and i would like to state the following.
as per the latest research based on human dna our ancestors are from africa. from there around 70- 60,000 years back they migrated and spread to various parts of the world. this group numbered only in the 100's.
the majority indians have predominantly two basic set of dna's ie ancestral south indian (asi) and ancestral north indian (ani) with a mixture of other strains. this was during the period approximating 1900- 4200 years back, which means that there was free mixture within the subcontinent during the above period.
the arrival of the dravidians is presumed to be 700 bc and and that of aryans around 300 bc.
the settlement of brahmins in kerala into villages was in the region of 600 ad. christianity reached kerala around 50 ad.
skin pigmentation which for us have caste connotations is a natural reaction of the skin to ultra violet radiation from sunlight.
moreover according to one study all of mankind living today is related to one man of the distant past. this is what the study of dna has told us.
i hope the above helps.

John Paul said...

As posted above, all modern Indians originated from the mixing of the genes of an Ancestral North Indian (ANI) population and an Ancestral South Indian (ASI) population. This gene mixing took place over the course of a couple of millennia in the not so distant past. This is the latest finding from genetic research conducted by a group of scientists on the ancestry of Indians
The ANI population was Caucasoid and was similar to the populations in Central Asia and Europe (sections of which must have migrated eastwards to India –agriculture and animal husbandry had been invented and the Indus valley civilization was in decline around the time) and the ASI population composed of Andamanese like natives found only in India (who could have been the remnants of the population that rose in India from the earlier mixing of Australoids and Central Asians some 30,000 years ago- as said by eminent geneticist Spencer Wells) and the ANI and ASI coexisted side by side before the mixing occurred.
The mixing between ANI and ASI began some 4200 years ago and ended some 1900 year ago. Around 100 AD, the gene mixing stopped abruptly and endogamy began among the different groups of this mixed population. This is surmised as the period when the caste system arose in India with its strict rules of social intercourse (The manusmriti was written around this time).The mixing was so thorough that genes of these two ancient Indian populations ie., the ANI and ASI, are now carried by every Indian in varying proportions (between 30% and 70% either way), ie., the fairest Kashmiri or Punjabi could have a minimum of 30% ASI genes and a maximum of 70% ANI genes and the darkest south Indian could have a minimum of 30% ANI genes and maximum of 70% ASI genes.
The average Indian (of every caste) could thus be carrying both ASI and ANI genes more or less equally!
This is the genetic story of India ie., all the 125 crore Indians living today arose from two parent populations as recently as 4000 years ago and share genes among them as siblings in a family do!

John Paul said...

The genetic story of the Syrian Christians is a sub-script to this. Just as the Anglo-Indians, ( who have mixed features of Europeans and Indians) arose from the mating of European colonists with Indian women, Syrian Christian Mappilas arose from the mating of Arab, Iraqi and Persian seafarer merchants with lower caste and scheduled caste/tribe women of Kerala during the pre-christian era and the 1st millennium AD (the resulting hybrid population had mixed features of West Asians and Indians and they congregated in ancient port towns of Kerala like Kodungallor, Niranam, Kollam etc and could later have been converted to Christianity by Persian missionaries who visited such Port towns; it is plausible that ancestors of such Persian missionaries were converted earlier by St.Thomas during his ministries in West Asia). This is apart from the large numbers of pure Dalits (especially from the Pulaya community) who were converted directly into Syrian Christianity during later centuries. Likewise, the Muslim mappilas of Malabar arose from the mating of muslim Arab traders with women of Kerala coast (from the Araya and other backward communities) from the 9th centry AD onwards. The muslim Mappilas freely admit this and have no problem in divulging their true ancestry. But this is not the case with Syrian Christian mappilas. They suffer from a collective inferiority complex and to camouflage this they proclaim a non-existent ‘nobility’ of birth for themselves. In vain attempts to establish this, they cling to fictions and fairy tales that move around in the garb of history. Thus, the majority of them are fooling themselves into believing that they are Brahmins who were converted to Christianity by St.Thomas in AD 52. It is high time that at least the thinking ones among them wake up to reality, realize and admit their true ancestry and identity. Otherwise, genetic science will sooner or later catch up with their bluff and bluster and unfold the truth for all to see (and laugh about) and by then, the self proclaimed Syrian Christian ‘Nampoothiri Brahmins’ who live today and boast of their ‘high’ birth would have long left this world and reached fools’ paradise to rest there for eternity savoring the imagined highness of their earthly life while their progeny in this world will become the butt of jokes resulting from the empty boasts of their foolhardy ancestors who quixotically imagined themselves to be of ‘highest’ origins when in reality they were of the lowest.

neel said...

While fully admiring Shankaracharya’s incredible intelligence and vedic proficiency , it is a fact that caste system came into Kerala after Shankaracharya's reclassification of the largely animistic Hindu Society, the Buddhists and Jains in Kerala ( probably between 650-750 AD). Kerala was a land where spices trade, agriculture and ayurveda ( taught and popularized by the Buddhist monks who made fresh compilations of the original ayurvedic texts ) flourished .The namboodris themselves came as impoverished refugees to Kerala in 500 to 600 A.D from the present Maharashtra Karnataka border areas . Most of the legends from Konkan region were transplanted here as a part of the social engineering and conversion from animistic to Vedic Hinduism. This resulted in the introduction of caste system and its evils in a society which was till then largely outside the vedic fold.
The most beautiful thing about Christianity is that there are no caste divisions and every one is equal; why then try to carve out illogical upper caste origins?

george abraham said...

Mr Tharakan"s COMMENTS THAT SYRIANS ARE CONVERTED FROM BARHMINS CANNOT BE ACCEPTED. DURING THE EARLY PERIOD AS CLAIMED BY THE AUTHOR THE BRAHMINS ARE NOT ARRIVED IN KERALA. BUT IT IS TRUE THAT THE MIGRANTS FROM MIDDLE EAST MAY HAVE MINGLED WITH THE CONVERTED CHRISTIANS SO THAT A BETTER COLOUR HAVE GOT THIS PEOPLE.THE PERIOD OF GETTING MONEY FROM ESPECIALLY ,RUBBER HAVE IN THOUGHT OF GETTING HIGH SOCIAL STATUS AS HE CLAIMED. THE LATINS OF ERNAKULAM DISTRICT IS IN ANOTHER STORY OF CLAIMING HIGHER CONVERTED CLASS. THE ANCIENT HOMES IN THAT AREA AND BASE OF CLASSICAL MUSIC ETC MAKES THEIR CLAIM THAT THEY ARE THE DECEDENTS OF HIGHER CLASS.SEE BAGAVATHERS LIKE YESUDAS.PAPUKUTTY BAGAVATHERS, ETC.

george abraham said...

Mr Tharakan"s COMMENTS THAT SYRIANS ARE CONVERTED FROM BARHMINS CANNOT BE ACCEPTED. DURING THE EARLY PERIOD AS CLAIMED BY THE AUTHOR THE BRAHMINS ARE NOT ARRIVED IN KERALA. BUT IT IS TRUE THAT THE MIGRANTS FROM MIDDLE EAST MAY HAVE MINGLED WITH THE CONVERTED CHRISTIANS SO THAT A BETTER COLOUR HAVE GOT THIS PEOPLE.THE PERIOD OF GETTING MONEY FROM ESPECIALLY ,RUBBER HAVE IN THOUGHT OF GETTING HIGH SOCIAL STATUS AS HE CLAIMED. THE LATINS OF ERNAKULAM DISTRICT IS IN ANOTHER STORY OF CLAIMING HIGHER CONVERTED CLASS. THE ANCIENT HOMES IN THAT AREA AND BASE OF CLASSICAL MUSIC ETC MAKES THEIR CLAIM THAT THEY ARE THE DECEDENTS OF HIGHER CLASS.SEE BAGAVATHERS LIKE YESUDAS.PAPUKUTTY BAGAVATHERS, ETC.

george abraham said...

The comments made by the Mr Tharakan cannot be counted,But certain middle class families near Ernakulam feel and claim that they are the converted from Namboothiries. They are thinking that their heridtary of xlassic activation is the above reason. please see the Families of sRI Yesudas,Papukutty Bagavadars etc.

Joshy said...

Interesting, and scientific truth especially when you look at the last few blogs from Pulikeel etc.

So here are the historical facts ---

- St Thomas did not come to Kerala ( there is no proof)

- When Vatican said this they were told to shut up.

- The so called people who claimed that they only got the right to worship God !!, came to Kerala during 6 th to 8th Century ACE. They called themselves Brahmins or Namboodiris, like some people in another geographical location thought that they were chosen or selected and (claimed for promised land)

- Modern genetics proves history. People claim baseless ideology because of lack of knowledge of Evolution, genetics, physics and science.

- A lot of people from different parts of the globe came to India thro' the ages, by wave of migration, peaceful settlement, and also by forceful settlement.
The Kings and Kingdoms either welcomed them , or had to fight with them. Some of them were given asylum.

- They indoctrinated their ideology, and gave India, and ( Kerala) their culture technology, religion, and also diseases like Gonorrrhea , and Syphilis. Some conversions were peaceful, some by force. If you look at the psychology of conversion, there is always some sort of force, and people who are vulnerable, and anxious will become victims of the promised reward.

- Molecular gentetics and evidence based research shows that modern humans migrated out of Africa about 60,000 to 70,000 years ago. M168 Genetic mutation, and Mitochondrial DNA studies converges to a point in Africa.

- We are all evolved from the Great Apes, which evolved out of a self replicating molecule ( DNA), thro' billions of years of adaptation and evolution.
Skin color is an adaptation to the intensity of sunlight on Earth. In short we are all from the Stardust of the cosmological event Big Bang.

- Keep your ego with you. The world does not care about your ego, and race you claim;it is only you who cares. Be proud of the Country,or land which gave you asylum.







Joshy said...

Continued
- Please note that wherever Portuguese people went they introduced St Thomas. e.g. India ( Kerala), South America etc.

- Those who settled in Kerala by force, and by peaceful means intermingled, married and exchanged the genetic pool. This is a historical fact. This happened in several parts of the Globe. At some places the males were nearly exterminated. DNA analysis proves this. I am not blaming any particular sect. But that' s how the world history is.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

One has to laugh at your stupid attempts to prove your fake identity with Jews on the basis of manipulated DNA. Mispairing is the common error in DNA replication.. Mispairing is known as wobble and it often occurs during DNA replication.. It occurs because the DNA double helix is flexible and able to accommodate slightly misshaped pairings. Replication errors can also involve insertions or deletions of nucleotide bases that occur during a process called strand slippage. Why this wicked attempt to steal the identity of Jews and Namboodiris? Are you still fond of pork sausages and beef burgers?
Your ridiculous attempt to link with Netanyahu or Golda Meir is like some lunatics in the mental hospitals claiming they are Alexanders or Napoleons. How can you distort Kerala history? Why Nambootiri record does not claim that some Namboodiri families become Christians? Who were the Jews who married pork-eating Christians before the pre-colonial period? Christians who assembled at the Coonen Cross revolt were all untouchables, mostly mukkuvas.
Who wants to read the manipulated, fabricated and fake Nasrani website? It is like Parayas claiming Jewish and Brahmin origin without any historical, literary, numismatic, cultural or archaeological evidence. The word ‘Nasrani’ was used in a contemptuous manner in the pre-colonial days. All false claims are based on imaginary songs like margamkali pattukal and manipulated family stories like niranam granthavali and ballads etc., – all originated in the 17th century and not in the 1st century when St. Thomas was in Mylapore.
Here is a news for you about DNA. Pork DNA has been found in halal chicken sausages served in a primary school in Westminster, central London, the local authority said.
The sausages were from St Mary’s Bryanston Square, a Church of England school, Westminster Council confirmed.Tests on a sample from Burdett Coutts School revealed the presence of lamb and pork DNA in lean minced beef. So Syrian DNA can also be found in a scavenger chaKiliya caste.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

One has to laugh at your stupid attempts to prove your fake identity with Jews on the basis of manipulated DNA. Mispairing is the common error in DNA replication.. Mispairing is known as wobble and it often occurs during DNA replication.. It occurs because the DNA double helix is flexible and able to accommodate slightly misshaped pairings. Replication errors can also involve insertions or deletions of nucleotide bases that occur during a process called strand slippage. Why this wicked attempt to steal the identity of Jews and Namboodiris? Are you still fond of pork sausages and beef burgers?
Your ridiculous attempt to link with Netanyahu or Golda Meir is like some lunatics in the mental hospitals claiming they are Alexanders or Napoleons. How can you distort Kerala history? Why Nambootiri record does not claim that some Namboodiri families become Christians? Who were the Jews who married pork-eating Christians before the pre-colonial period? Christians who assembled at the Coonen Cross revolt were all untouchables, mostly mukkuvas.
Who wants to read the manipulated, fabricated and fake Nasrani website? It is like Parayas claiming Jewish and Brahmin origin without any historical, literary, numismatic, cultural or archaeological evidence. The word ‘Nasrani’ was used in a contemptuous manner in the pre-colonial days. All false claims are based on imaginary songs like margamkali pattukal and manipulated family stories like niranam granthavali and ballads etc., – all originated in the 17th century and not in the 1st century when St. Thomas was in Mylapore.
Here is a news for you about DNA. Pork DNA has been found in halal chicken sausages served in a primary school in Westminster, central London, the local authority said.
The sausages were from St Mary’s Bryanston Square, a Church of England school, Westminster Council confirmed.Tests on a sample from Burdett Coutts School revealed the presence of lamb and pork DNA in lean minced beef. So Syrian DNA can also be found in a scavenger chaKiliya caste.
As a research scholar, I don’t have time and patience to read your nonsensical stuff. Let’s put a stop.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

One has to laugh at your stupid attempts to prove your fake identity with Jews on the basis of manipulated DNA. Mispairing is the common error in DNA replication.. Mispairing is known as wobble and it often occurs during DNA replication.. It occurs because the DNA double helix is flexible and able to accommodate slightly misshaped pairings. Replication errors can also involve insertions or deletions of nucleotide bases that occur during a process called strand slippage. Why this wicked attempt to steal the identity of Jews and Namboodiris? Are you still fond of pork sausages and beef burgers?
Your ridiculous attempt to link with Netanyahu or Golda Meir is like some lunatics in the mental hospitals claiming they are Alexanders or Napoleons. How can you distort Kerala history? Why Nambootiri record does not claim that some Namboodiri families become Christians? Who were the Jews who married pork-eating Christians before the pre-colonial period? Christians who assembled at the Coonen Cross revolt were all untouchables, mostly mukkuvas.
Who wants to read the manipulated, fabricated and fake Nasrani website? It is like Parayas claiming Jewish and Brahmin origin without any historical, literary, numismatic, cultural or archaeological evidence. The word ‘Nasrani’ was used in a contemptuous manner in the pre-colonial days. All false claims are based on imaginary songs like margamkali pattukal and manipulated family stories like niranam granthavali and ballads etc., – all originated in the 17th century and not in the 1st century when St. Thomas was in Mylapore.
Here is a news for you about DNA. Pork DNA has been found in halal chicken sausages served in a primary school in Westminster, central London, the local authority said.
The sausages were from St Mary’s Bryanston Square, a Church of England school, Westminster Council confirmed.Tests on a sample from Burdett Coutts School revealed the presence of lamb and pork DNA in lean minced beef. So Syrian DNA can also be found in a scavenger chaKiliya caste.

kochu pilla said...

My dear brother Abraham

Being a good Christian , before attempting these types of unnecessary controversies , I am strongly recommending you to go through the Second Vatican Council Decisions. Jesus taught love your neighbor as you love thyself.Do not get stuck on the Narcissism an pray to Jesus to see the goodness in each soul.

KOCHU PILLA

Unknown said...

Mr Tarakan you have opened a can of worms YOu are half caste Arab or jew or whatever origin you Syrian Christians are but please dont't smear the Catholics. YOu people even carry this attitude beyond the shores of Kerala telling other non-malayalees that the Latin Catholics are ALL from lower castes and All Syrian Christians are Brahmin origin? REally ALL of them. THat is the biggest joke. THe fair skin some of you have is from the Christian arab and low caste local women. PLease remember that.As a Christian we shouldn't even believe in caste. OH i forget you are A special breed!!!!!!

Unknown said...

Mr Tarakan you have opened a can of worms YOu are half caste Arab or jew or whatever origin you Syrian Christians are but please dont't smear the Catholics. YOu people even carry this attitude beyond the shores of Kerala telling other non-malayalees that the Latin Catholics are ALL from lower castes and All Syrian Christians are Brahmin origin? REally ALL of them. THat is the biggest joke. THe fair skin some of you have is from the Christian arab and low caste local women. PLease remember that.As a Christian we shouldn't even believe in caste. OH i forget you are A special breed!!!!!!

Easow Abe said...

If we look back, history will tell us that St. Thomas visited Kerala from Mylapore after making several conversions in Persia. The claim that St. Thomas visited Palayur and ordained four families as clergies from the Brahmin families of Pakalomattom (Pakalomattam) , Kalli ,Sankarapuri ,Kalikavu is a laughable figment of imagination because there were no Nambudiris in Kerala in 1st century A.D. The earliest notice of the existence of Christianity in Ceylon is that of Cosmos Indoplustes, an Egyptian merchant, and afterwards a monk, who published his ‘Christian Topography’. He says that Persian priests and merchants in Ceylon were mere sojourners and they did not marry the local people. That was the case in Kerala too. After a long interval after St. Thomas’ martyrdom, Persian missionaries came to Kerala occasionally and there was no mass migration of Persians or Assyrians to Kerala. So it becomes crystal clear that Christians converted by the Persians in Kerala were local residents. In those days of religious orthodoxy and caste consciousness, upper castes such as Nambudiris or Nairs could not be converted. But lower caste people who were in contact with the Persian missionaries such as fishermen (mukkuvas) barbers, dhobis, day labourers (parayas), coconut climbers in their compound (Ezhavas) and such others were made Christians.
The Portuguese occupation of Kerala for 150 years elevated all outcaste converts’ to a superior status. Even the Kochi Raja was made a subordinate vassal. Christians, irrespective of caste or status (Parayas, Pulayas etc.,) were appointed in the army and this made even Nambudiris and Nairs to be afraid of them and respect Christian army officers. Christians were appointed in Portuguese factories as accountants, messengers, planters in estates, cooks (famous Portuguese cuisine in Christian homes today, instead of kappa and fish), widespread intermarriage with low caste converts producing a new community with white colour and good physical features), brokers (tharakans) etc., It was this elevated status given by the Portuguese that has made Syrian Christians claim Nambudiri, Jew and now Assyrian descent, although all were from lower castes. “Rev. C.Y. Thomas in his book on Madhya Kerala Diocese points out: “Despite persistent persecutions, slave schools were opened in several places and the movement spread, gathering momentum with each new step. It is recorded that nine years after the first baptisms the Bishop of Madras visited the Mass Movement area and confirmed over a thousand outcaste Christians.”
Who are the present descendants of Ezhava, washerman, outcastes and slave converts? Hundreds of year’s existence has wiped out their untouchable past and now they flaunt the common community name of Syrian Christians, with the fake claim their ancestors were Nambudiris and Jews. When St. Xavier visited Kerala, he was greeted by two Christians. At that time the only church in Kerala was Syrian church and the two Christians were mukkuvas.






Unknown said...

Hello
People please post your comments on new blog by Mr Abraham. The present blog seems to be inactive.
New blog:http://parayilat.blogspot.com/2007/07/history-of-conversions-to-christianity.html
Thank you

Unknown said...

Hello
People please post your comments on new blog by Mr Abraham. The present blog seems to be inactive.
New blog:http://parayilat.blogspot.com/2007/07/history-of-conversions-to-christianity.html
Thank you

Thomas abraham said...

Based on some dna samples, some of the closest populations to kerala christians

[1,] "kerala-christian_harappa_7" "0"
[2,] "rajasthani_harappa_4" "2.994"
[3,] "singapore-indian-b_sgvp_41" "4.1918"
[4,] "tn-brahmin_xing_14" "4.6291"
[5,] "maharashtrian_harappa_4" "4.7937"
[6,] "iyer-brahmin_harappa_11" "4.9319"
[7,] "ap-brahmin_xing_25" "4.9891"
[8,] "iyengar-brahmin_harappa_7" "5.1369"
[9,] "karnataka-brahmin_harappa_4" "5.6943"
[10,] "meghawal_reich_5" "5.9054"
[11,] "up-muslim_metspalu_5" "7.1197"
[12,] "cochin-jew_behar_4" "7.4546"
[13,] "dharkar_metspalu_11" "7.4701"
[14,] "karnataka_harappa_4" "7.7441"
[15,] "andhra-pradesh_harappa_5" "7.8146"
[16,] "up-kshatriya_metspalu_7" "7.8495"
[17,] "ap-reddy_harappa_4" "8.1632"
[18,] "gujarati-b_hapmap_34" "8.2696"
[19,] "velama_metspalu_10" "8.4053"
[20,] "bihari-muslim_harappa_4" "8.6257"

Thomas abraham said...

On average, the genetic difference between kerala christians and South Indian brahmins tend to be about 5%, The south indian brahmins have a bit more Higher Northern Eastern European component, while the kerala christians have a higher South West Asian + Caucacusus (Assyrians) component due to immigrants from what is likely modern day Assyria. But overall Kerala christians are very much indian without about 5 - 10 % genetic input from ancient assyria.

Thomas abraham said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Thomas abraham said...

Syrian christians are a mix of about (60 - 70) percent upper caste converts (Either Kerala Brahmins/Kerala Nairs - Hard to tell because the populations are very close due to intermarriage, Nairs being more similar to kerala christians), (20 - 30))% lower caste converts and (5 - 10)% genetic influence from ancient assyrians (probably most similar to modern day kurds, syrians, turkish people)

Raju Rajan said...

Why Thomas Abraham is dragging the caste names of Nairs and Nambudiris? Even in the 21st century your metrans cannot get any Nair or Keralsa Brahmin to be converted. How could Nairs and brahmins become Christians in those days of caste consciousness and superstition? Can you show any source from Nair and brahmin communities family records of mass conversion? But church records, missionary diaries and journals have concrete proof of mass conversion of untouchables and slaves. Where are they now? Who are they now? They are the present Syrian Christians Genuine and not manipulated DNA analysis will prove it.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

New York Times gives the following news:
DNA Evidence Can Be Fabricated, Scientists Show
By ANDREW POLLACK

Scientists in Israel have demonstrated that it is possible to fabricate DNA evidence, undermining the credibility of what has been considered the gold standard of proof in criminal cases.The scientists fabricated blood and saliva samples containing DNA from a person other than the donor of the blood and saliva. They also showed that if they had access to a DNA profile in a database, they could construct a sample of DNA to match that profile without obtaining any tissue from that person.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

New York Times gives the following news:
DNA Evidence Can Be Fabricated, Scientists Show
By ANDREW POLLACK

Scientists in Israel have demonstrated that it is possible to fabricate DNA evidence, undermining the credibility of what has been considered the gold standard of proof in criminal cases.The scientists fabricated blood and saliva samples containing DNA from a person other than the donor of the blood and saliva. They also showed that if they had access to a DNA profile in a database, they could construct a sample of DNA to match that profile without obtaining any tissue from that person.

anil said...

Thomas is correct, I tested my dna as well. My y dna is R1a. The overall percentage of R y dna among syrian christians is 35 - 40 %(mostly R1a with some R2). Some of the other populations with high R1a are brahmins, kashmiris and certain pakistani populations. There is no mass conspiracy here - It is just simple dna analysis. All the analysis can be done at the websites below.

HAHA,i bet all the sites below are taking part in DNA manipulation of syrian christians from a tiny state in india called Kerala

http://www.harappadna.org/

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/syrianchristiansofindia/default.aspx?section=yresults

www.gedmatch.com

anil said...

Pattom - > You might want to email FAMILY TREE DNA, 23ANDME and ALL OTHER DNA SITES who are collecting data just so they could manipulate the dna of syrian christians from Kerala.

Pattom Radhakrishnan said...

DNA may be manipulated to get a false identity. But how can we manipulate historical facts? At the time of Coonen Cross pledge, there were 200,000 Christians. You cannot get so many people from Jewish and Nambudiri community. So they were all lower caste converts. This is reinforced by the fact that when St. Xavier came to Kochi, he was greeted by two Christians and both of them were mukkuvas (fishermen).At that time there was no CMS or Pentecost church. There was only one church, and that was Syrian church.
And again, genuine records maintained by pious missionaries of CMS give us an account of large-scale conversion of untouchables like Ezhavas at Kottayam, Pallam, Mallappally, Alappuzha (Norton converted hundreds of untouchables, Thiruvalla, Mavelikara, Chengannur, Kodukulanji, Mundakkayam Adoor. They are now known as Syrian Christians. If DNA data shows they are descendants of Jews or Nambudris, it is nothing but criminal manipulation. You just can't disown history. Lies to claim Jewish or Nambudiri descent will be ridiculous.

anil said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
anil said...

There is no lies here, I have analyzed my dna. I would say anyone would agree that it is easier to manipulate history records than it is to manipulate DNA. Are you asserting that Family Tree DNA, 23andme and Harappa DNA is engaging in DNA manipulation ? Why don't you get in touch with those companies and complain ?

I have already shown you solid proof regaring DNA from three sites. Please post actual records. I have already analyzed my DNA.

I have y dna R1a. The closest population autosomally to me is Tamil Brahmins, other south indian brahmins and certain north indian populations. The only other combination that I can think for me is if there was mass scale migration of Jews or assyrians and they mixed lower caste keralites. I don't think this is true because the R1a that I have matches closely with South Asian R1a and plus R y dna is lower in Middle Eastern populations, it is generally higher in higher caste population.

The only possible mix is either there were daily flights from Lahore to Kerala 1000 years ago and they mixed with lower caste or the most possible explanation is that a lot of syrian christian families descended from UP brahmins mixed with some lower caste mixed with a little bit of middle eastern people.

You can talk all about historical records, but DNA test do not lie. I have already presented DNA evidence here. If you feel it is a manipulation, please get in touch with Zach at http://www.harappadna.org/ or Family Tree dna. Have you even looked at any of the links that I have posted ?

anil said...

Thank god for DNA tests, Especially automsomal ones. The truth always comes out

Roy John said...

mr tharakan has opened a box- similar to pandoras' and quietly faded away. mr anil the last to comment has gone to great lengths to support mr tharaksns' claim of nambudiri and high caste conversions.
on the other hand our own mangalyaan is speeding away on its tryst with another planet. meanwhile nasas' probe crossed the outer limits of the
solar system some time back. here what we found is that there is no intelligent life in all of the solar system. maybe some light years away (4.234 light years)in proxima centauri there may be life. only GOD knows, that is, if there is a GOD. also dna studies has shown that all of mankind is related to one man from the african continent. like wise from the maternal side also.
so what is mr tharakan, mr anil and everybody else trying to say.

Roy John said...

mr tharakan has opened a box- similar to pandoras' and quietly faded away. mr anil the last to comment has gone to great lengths to support mr tharaksns' claim of nambudiri and high caste conversions.
on the other hand our own mangalyaan is speeding away on its tryst with another planet. meanwhile nasas' probe crossed the outer limits of the
solar system some time back. here what we found is that there is no intelligent life in all of the solar system. maybe some light years away (4.234 light years)in proxima centauri there may be life. only GOD knows, that is, if there is a GOD. also dna studies has shown that all of mankind is related to one man from the african continent. like wise from the maternal side also.
so what is mr tharakan, mr anil and everybody else trying to say.

Roy John said...

mr tharakan has opened a box- similar to pandoras' and quietly faded away. mr anil the last to comment has gone to great lengths to support mr tharaksns' claim of nambudiri and high caste conversions.
on the other hand our own mangalyaan is speeding away on its tryst with another planet. meanwhile nasas' probe crossed the outer limits of the
solar system some time back. here what we found is that there is no intelligent life in all of the solar system. maybe some light years away (4.234 light years)in proxima centauri there may be life. only GOD knows, that is, if there is a GOD. also dna studies has shown that all of mankind is related to one man from the african continent. like wise from the maternal side also.
so what is mr tharakan, mr anil and everybody else trying to say.

John S K said...

Whole lot of crap and nothing but crap, After all these centuries since the crucification of Christ this rather silly blog on the so called Kerala's upper caste conversion to Christianity is a sick man's fictitious and cooked up crap!!!

anil said...

Not really fictitious, just simple DATA ANALYSIS and I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH. With advances in genetics research, there is no need for SUBJECTIVE TRUTH. Not that any of this matters, we are all part of the same human tree from Africa. I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH, if the DATA was different, I would have inferred different population sources based on DATA. My analysis is solely based on DATA AVAILABLE.

anil said...

Not really fictitious, just simple DATA ANALYSIS and I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH. With advances in genetics research, there is no need for SUBJECTIVE TRUTH. Not that any of this matters, we are all part of the same human tree from Africa. I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH, if the DATA was different, I would have inferred different population sources based on DATA. My analysis is solely based on DATA AVAILABLE.

anil said...

Not really fictitious, just simple DATA ANALYSIS and I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH. With advances in genetics research, there is no need for SUBJECTIVE TRUTH. Not that any of this matters, we are all part of the same human tree from Africa. I like OBJECTIVE TRUTH, if the DATA was different, I would have inferred different population sources based on DATA. My analysis is solely based on DATA AVAILABLE.

Roy John said...

dear mr anil, the objective truth is that we are alone in the solar system. maybe in this corner of the universe also. so kindly refrain from reducing our noble lineage into mere upper caste lower caste debates.
syrian, latin, brahmin, nair tags should have ceased with true knowledge, alas it is still raging.
shame on you people.

anil said...

There is nothing wrong in knowing what populations gave rise to certain populations based on DATA ANALYSIS. Castes don't really have importance in India anymore(maybe rural parts), however at one point when WEST ASIANS arrived and they intermingled with SOUTH ASIANS, mixing happened for some time but it stopped and some sort of events gave rise to caste system and populations became differentiated. If there were no castes we would just be like Chinese population. Since there was a differentiation in our history and since the topic is about conversions, I just stated what populations would have contributed to the christian conversions based on DNA DATA.

Due to DNA data analysis I now know that almost all POPULATIONS HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO MY DNA, this makes me feel closer to populations around the world. I think this knowledge is good because it SHOWS THE WORLD HOW WE ARE ALL ONE AND TAKES AWAY THE DIFFERENTIATION.

It is the curiosity and thirst for knowledge that propels our civilization forward. There is NO TRUE KNOWLEDGE, it is just a quest to know more about what we all perceive.

anil said...

There is nothing wrong in knowing what populations gave rise to certain populations based on DATA ANALYSIS. Castes don't really have importance in India anymore(maybe rural parts), however at one point when WEST ASIANS arrived and they intermingled with SOUTH ASIANS, mixing happened for some time but it stopped and some sort of events gave rise to caste system and populations became differentiated. If there were no castes we would just be like Chinese population. Since there was a differentiation in our history and since the topic is about conversions, I just stated what populations would have contributed to the christian conversions based on DNA DATA.

Due to DNA data analysis I now know that almost all POPULATIONS HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO MY DNA, this makes me feel closer to populations around the world. I think this knowledge is good because it SHOWS THE WORLD HOW WE ARE ALL ONE HUMAN POPULATION AND TAKES AWAY THE DIFFERENTIATION.

It is the curiosity and thirst for knowledge that propels our civilization forward. There is NO TRUE KNOWLEDGE, it is just a quest to know more about what we all perceive.

Rajan Rajiv said...

@Anil
The large crowd that assembled at Coonen Cross pledge was from lower and untouchable castes. They were converted by Persian missionaries. There is nothing on record to say that Persians married the native Hindus to make them Christians. But there is documentary evidence to prove Portuguese marrying local Hindus from the time of Albuquerque. The Portuguese were in Kochi for 150 years and during this period mixed marriages produced several generations of Christians. CMS missionaries converted mainly untouchables and slaves and the Syrian population multiplied by widespread intermarriage with Portuguese converts. And this helped the untouchable Syrian converts (converted by CMS Missionaries), mainly in Kottayam, Mallappaly, Thiruvalla, Chengannur, Mavelikara, Alappuzha, to get good physical features and white colour. So they claim Nambudhiri, Jew and (now) Assyrian descent.
DNA testing will not be correct. A Syrian Christian with Ezhava blood (It is a fact of History that Ezhavas were the major converts by CMS issionaries) can easily manipulate DNA testing and claim Jewish or Nambudhiri descent.
When DNA evidence was first introduced, a number of experts testified that false positives are impossible in forensic DNA testing. Whether such claims are sinister or not, they are misleading because humans are necessarily involved in conducting DNA tests. Among the first 200 people exonerated by post-conviction DNA testing were two men (Timothy Durham and Josiah Sutton) who were convicted in the first place due partly to DNA testing errors. In both cases a combination of technical problems in the laboratory and careless or mistaken interpretation of the test results produced misleading DNA evidence that helped send innocent men to prison for many years.13 False DNA matches have come to light in a number of other cases as well.
False incriminations can occur in forensic DNA testing, including coincidental DNA profile matches between different people, inadvertent or accidental transfer of cellular material or DNA from one item to another, errors in identification or labeling of samples, misinterpretation of test results, and intentional planting of biological evidence.

Mike Varghese said...

I believe there was mixing in our Nasrani community. It makes more sense that we mixed with Semitic people like Jews and Persian Christians (Church of the East), because of the historical migrations. There is a lot of people with fair or light skin, Semitic and Caucasian features, light eyes, and height in our Nasrani community. These physical attributes couldn't be from low caste people. Our culture and customs are a mix of local Malayali and Semitic. Why do we have Semitic names if we are not mixed? I'm 5'10, light brown skin, light brown eyes, long straight and narrow nose. My dad looks like a Persian guy. Half of the people in my family (immediate family, cousins, relatives) can pass for Southern European or Middle Eastern. Who are you to say there was no mixing happening since ancient times? Look at the Jews in Kerala or India, they all look Indian, even all of the Anglo-Indians look Indian. Parsi's look Indian, some Irani's look different. Why are Muslims and Nasranis in Kerala taller and better looking than most Hindus? It's because they are mixed. People are just jealous that others have a different ancestry. There are too many idiots out there bashing others, that is why I hate calling myself Indian or Malayali.

Rajan Rajiv said...

Physical attributes cannot give a superior caste status to the population. The Home Minister Shinde and the diplomat Devyani are from untouchable castes. The color and physical features cannot change their original caste. EMS, a Nambudhiri Brahmin, was dark, short and his pysical features, especially flat nose and dowdy face, are not at all attractive. Whereas, another Kerala CM, Shankar, was an Ezhava and his colr and appearance are like a patrician. Thiyyas of Malabar are white in color and most of the circus girls are Thiyyas. The Muslims of Malabar, quoted by you, are descendants the cherumars or cherumakkal, the lowest of the lower castes, and the skin color they got because of intermarriage with Arab traders and they are known as Moplahs. The Zamorin encouraged the Mukkuvas and Cherumrs to marry the Arabss. Syrian Christian mappillais would also have come when some Persians married untouchables, for in a caste oriented Kerala society, no B rahmin or Nayar woman would venture to marry missionaries or traders from Persia. It is stated that Thomas of cana married two lower caste women. If you judge a person by skin color and physicl features, the present Metropolitan of Mar Thoma church will have to be placed in the lower caste category. The Portuguese occupation of Kerala for 150 years, and the official implementation of marriages of Portuguese soldiers and other employees with local Hindu wimen by Albuqurque and later the widespread marriages of local Christians with Portuguese converts with white color and good features are the real causes for white color and good physical features for Syrian Christians. In Thrissur there are even now girls with streaks of blonde hair along with black hair. There is nothing on record to show that Persians or assyrians married local Hindus to make them Christians.

Mike Varghese said...

Rajan Rajiv, I think you are getting confused between Portuguese converted and intermarried Christians with Nasranis, they are two different things. The Europeans converted low caste people and other Nasranis to another form of Christianity. First, the Portuguese came and then the British. We Nasranis follow Eastern Syriac and Western Syriac traditions and rituals. I am a Syrian Orthodox Christian and I have no family members that are Catholics. We marry among our own Nasrani community like we have been doing for two thousand years. The Portuguese converted and intermarried Christians usually would have Portuguese surnames. We Nasranis have local Malayali and Semitic names. You can't put newly converted Christians and other new Christian denominations with Nasranis, it's like comparing apples and oranges. The newer denominations follow a Western influenced style of worship, while Nasranis follow an ancient Semitic type of worship. If we were low caste, then why did the local kings of Kerala use Nasranis, Jews, and Muslims as soldiers? Being a soldier in ancient times in Kerala means nobility. All of the mixed people in Kerala had great privileges equal to the higher castes. You can't downgrade people from any religion, because Christianity and Islam are on the rise in Kerala, which will be the majority in the future.

Rajan Rajiv said...

It is a common belief among Christians that St. Thomas visited Kerala and converted some people and built churches. Although Pope Benedict, a research scholar, doubts the visit of St. Thomas, his presence in the court of Gondopharnes is a historical fact. Thomas would have come to Kerla from Persia after constructing a church in Mylapore and converting some people there. St Thomas, a Jew, did not marry a Hindu to create a Christian-Jew population in Kerala. But after St. Thomas left Kerala, there was a long interval when no priest was coming to Kerala. Although some names of bishops are mentioned, it is not proved from the records kept in Assyrian or Chaldean churches in Antioch or Odissa. Contemporary events in other parts of Asia will make us understand what actually happened in Kerala. Christianity was introduced in Persia in the Parthian period, and several bishoprics were established there. That the Persian church was itself active in proselytizing abroad at the end of the Sasanian period (224-651). It was only from second century onwards Missionaries were sent from Persia to India, Sri Lanka and china. The most widely accepted record of the earliest existence of Christianity in China is a stone stele dated 781 A.D. that detailed Christian missionaries’ activities and the propagation of the religion in China. There were Christians in Sri Lanka long before the arrival of the Portuguese. The Persian cross found in Anuradhapura in the 5th century A.D. proves that Christians have been travelling, trading or living in Sri Lanka even during the early Anuradhapura period.
What happened in Persia,China and Sri Lanka had happened in Kerala also. Persian missionaries did not marry local people in these countries. There is no proof that Persians or Assyrians or Jews married local Hindus to create a Christian population. There was no Persian or Assyrian mass migration due to persecution as falsely claimed by Syrian Christians. Historical records tell us that during the persecution, they migrated to Iraq, Syria and Turkey (Antoich) and not to Kerala. These historical events tell us that Persian missionaries who came to Kerala converted lower caste Hindus, mostly mukkuvas and Ezhavas. This is evidenced by the fsct that there were 200,000 people at the site of the Coonen Cross. It goes without saying that there wouldn't have been more than 100 Nambudhiris and 30 Jews in and around Mattancherry. So the demographic statistcs will prove that there was no Nambudhiri or Jewish conversion. Those people at Coonen Cross were local and it is absurd to claim Assyrian or Jewish or Nambudhiri pedigree. It is a fact of history that even before CMS missionaries came to Kerala and converted untouchables, the people who assembled at Coonen Cross site were not Nambudhiris, or Jews or Assyrians, but lower castes. This historical fact cannot be blotted out by making fake claims that there were Jewish and Nambudhiri or Assyrian Christians before the arrival of the Portuguese.


Joshy said...

There are no real scientific evidence for any of the above claims.

It is all about your ego. Please be aware that the world does not care about your egos. It is only you who care about it, and live with it - So sad, get some counseling.

Scientific evidence shows that about 98% of your DNA is exactly the same as that of Chimps. You evolved out of a single celled self replicated genetic code through billions of years of evolution.

Skin colour is an adaptation to sunlight,and as other phenotypical features to various other factors.

You are evolved product, like any other living being, and got the ability to think - think wisely, and do not undermine other fellow living beings.
Get a life ------

Rajan Rajiv said...

In Kerala history there is absolutely no evidence of Nambudhiris or Jews becoming Christians. But Syrian Christians quote some customs and marriage rituals of Brahmins to claim Brahmin ancestry. The claim of Syrian Christians that tying of thali is a proof that they are descendants of Nambudhiris is not correct because untouchables such as Parayas, Pulayas, mukkuvas, vannans and others tie thali. Paul Roche gives this account of Paraya Catholic marriage: “The priest, though of higher caste, does not treat the Paraiya couple as untouchables. He blesses the couple and says Mass for them. The symbol of the wedding union is the thali. The thali is a gold medal on a yellow thin string. It is yellow because it is dyed with turmeric (Manjal). During Mass the priest blesses the thali and hands it over to the bridegroom who ties it around the neck of the bride. The priest also blesses two flower garlands and hands one each to the bridegroom and the bride who garland each other.”
Quite surprisingly, Syrian Christians also claim that Church built on the model of a Hindu temple is another proof for their Nambudhiri ancestry. But Paraya and Pulaya temples are also like Nair temples. What separates Syrian Christians from Nambudhiri Brahmin and links them to lower castes is their lifestyle and food habits. Syrian Christian settlements were seen on the coastal area and thick jungles. But Nambudhiri settlements were inside villages, near temples and tanks.Syrian Christians like Parayas eat beef and pork. But Nambudhiris are vegetarians. Nambudhiris wear a sacred thread (poonool) which is conspicuously absent in Syrian Chrisdtians. Nairs followed matrinelial system but Syrian Christians like Parayas follow patrilineal system and their surnames are generally inherited from the father and property passes to the sons. To camouflage this, people like Gigi Thomson claim, “"We are supposed to have been part of the Hindu nobility before St Thomas converted us, so many consider themselves a cut above the rest.” Gigi Thomson lives in a fantasy world thinking St.Thomas converted Nambudhiris to claim ‘nobility status’ without realizing the historical fact that there were no Nambudhiris when St Thomas came in the Ist century A.D. There is also no reference to the conversion of Chera kings. Nairs were also not converted, for Kerala history has recorded that Nairs used Syrian Christians to do free labour (oozhiyam) in their farmlands. So it is quite transparent that only lower castes who alone were available for conversion, were singled out for conversion. Those lower caste converts got superior status in society because during the 150 year rule of the Portuguese, the Portuguese elevated them by appointing them as soldiers, police. Brokers, accountants in their factories, planters of estates, merchants and traders, priests, teachers and trustworthy messengers and thereby elevated their economic status. The British opened schools and colleges for the lower caste cionverts and made them culturally superior to Nambudhiris and Nairs. Albuqurque’s policy of interracial marriage by which the Portuguese married Hindu women produced a race white in colour with good physical features.The Portuguese and the British elevated the Syrian community financially wealthy and educationally cultured far superior to Nambudhiris and Nairs of today.

Ginto Thomas said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Judish Xavier said...

Whatever dna you are carrying.You are still in a country which claims to be full with intelligent dna's and superior dna's....but still the country is rated as third world.Is this what the superior dna's result.Please avoid this mask and be a part to make our country better.fight against those who are corrupting our country and make every one in our country to be happy.Then i salute your DNA...thats real DNA ..which can change the hearts.. not the dna with power of money..

anil said...

@Rajan Rajiv

There is no DNA manipulation happening period !! Please educate yourself.
I am arguing based on genetics. This is not about SUPERIORITY, it is just plain
DNA analysis, Whatever it is, it just is. I hate "HEARING FAMILY HISTORY BULLSHIT" so
I rather just analysis DNA.Please go the following sites and argue based on DNA analysis.


ACCORDING TO YOU THE SITES BELOW ARE ENGAGING IN DNA MANIPULATION. PLEASE EMAIL THEM
AND TELL THEM NOT TO MANIPULATE KERALA CHRISTIAN SAMPLES

http://ww2.gedmatch.com:8006/autosomal/select.php
http://dodecad.blogspot.com/
http://www.harappadna.org/
https://www.familytreedna.com

CLOSEST SAMPLES TO KERALA CHRISTIANS FROM DODECAD(IN MY OPINION, THE MOST INFORMATIVE WEBSITE ON GENETICS
), The information in the brackets
are PERCENTAGES. THIS IS AUTOSOMAL ANALYSIS, THAT MEANS COMPLETE DNA ANALYSIS

1,] "kerala-christian_harappa_7" "0"
[2,] "rajasthani_harappa_4" "2.994"
[3,] "singapore-indian-b_sgvp_41" "4.1918"
[4,] "tn-brahmin_xing_14" "4.6291"
[5,] "maharashtrian_harappa_4" "4.7937"
[6,] "iyer-brahmin_harappa_11" "4.9319"
[7,] "ap-brahmin_xing_25" "4.9891"
[8,] "iyengar-brahmin_harappa_7" "5.1369"
[9,] "karnataka-brahmin_harappa_4" "5.6943"
[10,] "meghawal_reich_5" "5.9054"
[11,] "up-muslim_metspalu_5" "7.1197"
[12,] "cochin-jew_behar_4" "7.4546"
[13,] "dharkar_metspalu_11" "7.4701"
[14,] "karnataka_harappa_4" "7.7441"
[15,] "andhra-pradesh_harappa_5" "7.8146"
[16,] "up-kshatriya_metspalu_7" "7.8495"
[17,] "ap-reddy_harappa_4" "8.1632"
[18,] "gujarati-b_hapmap_34" "8.2696"
[19,] "velama_metspalu_10" "8.4053"
[20,] "bihari-muslim_harappa_4" "8.6257"


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Y-chromosome_DNA_haplogroup --- Y DNA HAPLOGROUPS ARE PASSED ON THROUGH MALES

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/SyrianChristiansOfIndia/default.aspx?section=yresults

The overall percentage of R y dna among syrian christians is 35 - 40 %(mostly R1a with some R2)

R1A AND R2 Y DNA IS MOSTLY FOUND IN SOUTH ASIA (HIGHER PERCENTAGES IN UPPER CASTE POPULATIONS),
IT ACCOUNTS FOR 40% OF DNA IN FAMILY TREE, J2a ANOTHER 30% AND IT MOSTLY MATCHES MIDDLE EASTERN
J Y DNA. LOOKING AT THE ALL THE DATA SYRIAN CHRISTIANS ARE A HYBRID POPULATION DERIVED MAINLY
FROM SOUTH ASIAN POPULATIONS WITH A LITTLE BIT OF MIDDLE EASTERN INFLUENCE.

Please DON'T ARGUE BY POSTING ABOUT HISTORY AND MAKING ASSUMPTIONS. IF YOU FEEL LIKE THE DATA ABOVE IS NOT ENOUGH
ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS GET MORE KERALA CHRISTIANS TO TEST ON THE SITES ABOVE.
THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SUPERIORITY, IT SHOULD BE OBJECTIVE. ARGUMENTS ABOUT DNA MANIPULATION ARE COMPLETE BULLSHIT
AND JUST SILLY.

anil said...

@Rajan Rajiv

There is no DNA manipulation happening period !! Please educate yourself.
I am arguing based on genetics. This is not about SUPERIORITY, it is just plain
DNA analysis, Whatever it is, it just is. I hate "HEARING FAMILY HISTORY BULLSHIT" so
I rather just analysis DNA.Please go the following sites and argue based on DNA analysis.


ACCORDING TO YOU THE SITES BELOW ARE ENGAGING IN DNA MANIPULATION. PLEASE EMAIL THEM
AND TELL THEM NOT TO MANIPULATE KERALA CHRISTIAN SAMPLES

http://ww2.gedmatch.com:8006/autosomal/select.php
http://dodecad.blogspot.com/
http://www.harappadna.org/
https://www.familytreedna.com

CLOSEST SAMPLES TO KERALA CHRISTIANS FROM DODECAD(IN MY OPINION, THE MOST INFORMATIVE WEBSITE ON GENETICS
), The information in the brackets
are PERCENTAGES. THIS IS AUTOSOMAL ANALYSIS, THAT MEANS COMPLETE DNA ANALYSIS

1,] "kerala-christian_harappa_7" "0"
[2,] "rajasthani_harappa_4" "2.994"
[3,] "singapore-indian-b_sgvp_41" "4.1918"
[4,] "tn-brahmin_xing_14" "4.6291"
[5,] "maharashtrian_harappa_4" "4.7937"
[6,] "iyer-brahmin_harappa_11" "4.9319"
[7,] "ap-brahmin_xing_25" "4.9891"
[8,] "iyengar-brahmin_harappa_7" "5.1369"
[9,] "karnataka-brahmin_harappa_4" "5.6943"
[10,] "meghawal_reich_5" "5.9054"
[11,] "up-muslim_metspalu_5" "7.1197"
[12,] "cochin-jew_behar_4" "7.4546"
[13,] "dharkar_metspalu_11" "7.4701"
[14,] "karnataka_harappa_4" "7.7441"
[15,] "andhra-pradesh_harappa_5" "7.8146"
[16,] "up-kshatriya_metspalu_7" "7.8495"
[17,] "ap-reddy_harappa_4" "8.1632"
[18,] "gujarati-b_hapmap_34" "8.2696"
[19,] "velama_metspalu_10" "8.4053"
[20,] "bihari-muslim_harappa_4" "8.6257"


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Y-chromosome_DNA_haplogroup --- Y DNA HAPLOGROUPS ARE PASSED ON THROUGH MALES

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/SyrianChristiansOfIndia/default.aspx?section=yresults

The overall percentage of R y dna among syrian christians is 35 - 40 %(mostly R1a with some R2)

R1A AND R2 Y DNA IS MOSTLY FOUND IN SOUTH ASIA (HIGHER PERCENTAGES IN UPPER CASTE POPULATIONS),
IT ACCOUNTS FOR 40% OF DNA IN FAMILY TREE, J2a ANOTHER 30% AND IT MOSTLY MATCHES MIDDLE EASTERN
J Y DNA. LOOKING AT THE ALL THE DATA SYRIAN CHRISTIANS ARE A HYBRID POPULATION DERIVED MAINLY
FROM SOUTH ASIAN POPULATIONS WITH A LITTLE BIT OF MIDDLE EASTERN INFLUENCE.

Please DON'T ARGUE BY POSTING ABOUT HISTORY AND MAKING ASSUMPTIONS. IF YOU FEEL LIKE THE DATA ABOVE IS NOT ENOUGH
ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS GET MORE KERALA CHRISTIANS TO TEST ON THE SITES ABOVE.
THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SUPERIORITY, IT SHOULD BE OBJECTIVE. ARGUMENTS ABOUT DNA MANIPULATION ARE COMPLETE BULLSHIT
AND JUST SILLY.

Rajan Rajiv said...

@anil
DNA can be faked. Apart from DNA, we have to think in a realistic manner. There were very few Jews in Kerala in Ist century A.D. There is no record of their conversion. The had remained as Jews, following Judaism and attending their synagogue (both white and black Jews). There were no Nambudhiris in Kerala in Ist century A.D. Now the question is: How did the Syrian Christian population increase? At the time of Coonen Cross pledge, there were 200,000 Christians. Assuming for argument sake, even if the Jews had been converted, the number would not exceed 100; if the entire Nambudhiri population of Mattancherry had been converted, the number would not exceed 1000. So it is a clear evidence that on population basis, only lower castes and coastal mukkuvas, could raise Syrian Christian population to 200,000.
In a paper in the journal Forensic Science International: Genetics, geneticist Dan Frumkin outlines how, using information in a genetic database, he recreated and amplified someone's DNA, and mixed it with DNA-less red blood cells, and created fake blood that could contaminate a crime scene. Frumkin then sent the fake blood to a lab in the US for analysis. The American lab sequenced the sample, and did not figure out that the blood was fake.

Interestingly, Frumkin actually founded a company that hopes to sell a method for detecting fabricated DNA to crime labs

anil said...

@Rajan Rajiv,
I am only doing data analysis. You are basically telling every large
company that does DNA ANALYSIS or DOES DNA Testing is FRAUD ? I
really don't even no what to say when you make random statements.

THERE IS NO CLEAR EVIDENCE, YOU ARE JUST MAKING RANDOM STATEMENTS AND
MAKING ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO AND CALLING
IT EVIDENCE. THANK GOD MOST PEOPLE IN THE WORLD DO NOT REASON LIKE YOU.

IF YOU WANT TO ANALYZE DATA, PLEASE READ INTO SOMETHING ABOUT DNA OR DO
SOME ANALYSIS, THAT WAY WE CAN ATLEAST HAVE AN INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION INSTEAD
CALLING EVERY MAJOR DNA AND EVERY ANALYSIS DONE BY DNA COMPANIES FRAUD ?

I ONLY BELIEVE IN SCIENCE PERIOD....WHAT IS OBJECTIVE IS OBJECTIVE AND CANNOT
BE UNTRUE JUST BECAUSE YOU MAKE RANDOM STATEMENTS. PLEASE MAKE SOME INTELLIGENT
ARGUMENTS INSTEAD OF CALLING EVERY MAJOR DNA COMPANY FRAUD.

I AM ONLY GOING TO POST MY ANALYSIS BASED ON SCIENCE.

PLEASE LOOK AT THE SITES BELOW OR DO SOME READING INTO DNA ATLEAST BEFORE MAKING RANDOM STATEMENTS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Y-chromosome_DNA_haplogroup --- Y DNA HAPLOGROUPS ARE PASSED ON THROUGH MALES

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/SyrianChristiansOfIndia/default.aspx?section=yresults

http://ww2.gedmatch.com:8006/autosomal/select.php

******** DETAILED ANALYSIS OF INDIAN COMMUNITES BELOW **************

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2013/08/what-the-harappa-ancestry-project-has-resolved/#.Uz9ISFejbEw






anil said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
anil said...

@Rajan Rajiv,
I am only doing data analysis. You are basically telling every large
company that does DNA ANALYSIS or DOES DNA Testing is FRAUD ? I
really don't even know what to say when you make random statements.

THERE IS NO CLEAR EVIDENCE, YOU ARE JUST MAKING RANDOM STATEMENTS AND
MAKING ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO AND CALLING
IT EVIDENCE. THANK GOD MOST PEOPLE IN THE WORLD DO NOT REASON LIKE YOU.

IF YOU WANT TO ANALYZE DATA, PLEASE READ INTO SOMETHING ABOUT DNA OR DO
SOME ANALYSIS, THAT WAY WE CAN ATLEAST HAVE AN INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION INSTEAD
CALLING EVERY MAJOR DNA AND EVERY ANALYSIS DONE BY DNA COMPANIES FRAUD ?

I ONLY BELIEVE IN SCIENCE PERIOD....WHAT IS OBJECTIVE IS OBJECTIVE AND CANNOT
BE UNTRUE JUST BECAUSE YOU MAKE RANDOM STATEMENTS. PLEASE MAKE SOME INTELLIGENT
ARGUMENTS INSTEAD OF CALLING EVERY MAJOR DNA COMPANY FRAUD.

I AM ONLY GOING TO POST MY ANALYSIS BASED ON SCIENCE.

PLEASE LOOK AT THE SITES BELOW OR DO SOME READING INTO DNA ATLEAST BEFORE MAKING RANDOM STATEMENTS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Y-chromosome_DNA_haplogroup --- Y DNA HAPLOGROUPS ARE PASSED ON THROUGH MALES

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/SyrianChristiansOfIndia/default.aspx?section=yresults

http://ww2.gedmatch.com:8006/autosomal/select.php

******** DETAILED ANALYSIS OF INDIAN COMMUNITES BELOW **************

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2013/08/what-the-harappa-ancestry-project-has-resolved/#.Uz9ISFejbEw






Rajan Rajiv said...

@anil.
You have stated:
I ONLY BELIEVE IN SCIENCE PERIOD." Demography is also a science. You have also said, I am"making 'random statements,' but it is concrete. We know from Kerala History that the present Syrian Christian centers were once places of CMS missionaries stations - Kottayam, Mallappally, Alappuzha, Thiruvalla, Kodukulanji, Chengannur, Mavelikkara, Mundakkayam etc., Those devoted missionaries have recorded in their diaries the number of lower castes converted by them and the dates. Before the coming of CMS missionaries, the number of Syrian Christians assembled to take the Coonen Cross pledge shows mass conversion from local lower castes. So demography is also a science. DNA is also a science. But here it is faked. How can an Ezhave blood show Jewish or Nambudiri blood?

Jo Aby said...

Most histories are biased or one sided. Each side have a different story.
For a neutral version please read: http://joneworld.blogspot.in/2014/04/history-of-stthomas-christians-of-kerala.html

Rajan Rajiv said...

Malankara Syrian Christians also belonged to the local caste system. Racial and ethnic history of Kerala shows many races such as Negrito, Proto-Australoid, and the Mediterranean. Mediterraneans form the main element of present Dravidian population of Kerala. Malankara Syrian Christians were not imported from Syria. They were all locals. Can the Christians converted by London Missionary Society claim that they are not local castes but linked to London? In the same manner some Persian missionaries converted some locals but they did not marry local lower caste women. As in the history of conversion by Persian missionaries in Sri Lanka and China during the same period when they came to Kerala, those missionaries did not marry the locals and they did not settle permanently in Kerala. When the Portuguese came to Kerala, they could not see a single Persian missionary, but churches were managed by illiterate local priests with little knowledge of the Bible but having Nestorian and heretical Hindu beliefs. Christian converts were initially called by the locals as 'Chrishu Madhakkar' and later as Mappilais, probably it would be easier to get husbands (mappillais) from that community. It was only after the Arabs and other Muslims came to Kerala, Christians were called by them in a contemptuous manner as Nasranis.The true economic and social condition of the Christians who were ridiculously called Nasranis by higher castes was recorded by a missionary when European powers were slowly establishing their authority; Abbe J.A. Dubois, a missionary in Mysore, in his letter dated August 7, 1815, writes: “The Jesuits, on their first arrival in India, hearing of them, in one way or other converted the greatest part to the Catholic faith. Their liturgy is to this day in the Syrian language, and in the performance of their religious ceremonies they use this ancient dead tongue. There remains still among them large congregations, consisting of 70 or 80,000 Christians, of whom two-thirds are Catholics, and a third Nestorians. They are all designated under the contemptuous name of Nazarany, and held by the pagans in still greater contempt than the Christians of this part of the country. The Nairs chiefly keep them at a greatest distance, and they form a separate caste.”
Even today in the Muslim world of the Middle East, Christians are contemptuously called Nasranis. In Kerala also after the coming of the Muslims, Christians were slightingly called Nasranis by the locals, as they called Ezhavas, 'Chovans.'
Another distortion of Kerla history by some Syrians is that there was a mass migration of Assyrians at the time of persecution in the Middle East. But Church history is quite explicit that the Assyrians fled to Iraq, Turkey (Antioch), Lebanon and Persia but not to India. At Coonen Cross Oath there were 200,000 Christians. By any stretch of imagination, there could not be more than 35 Jewish families and 100 Namboothiri families in and around Mattencherry. The Jews (white and black) attended their respective synagoues and they were not Christians. Namboothiris were using Syrian Christians as coolies in their paddy fields and Government ordered them to do oozhiyam service in their fields. So the crowd at the Coonen Cross consisted of lower castes. Early eye- witness account by Portuguese and British missionaies was the Nasrani Christians were treated contemptuously by higher castes and their social and economic status was in a pathetic condition. So Malankara also belongs to local society, most of them from the lowest strata of society before they were elevated by the Portuguese and the British.

anil said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
anil said...

@Rajan

DO YOU BELIEVE IN SCIENCE (DNA ANALYSIS) OR SOME RANDOM STATEMENTS MADE BY RANDOM PEOPLE ?

IF YOU BELIEVE IN RANDOM STATEMENTS AND NOT ON OBJECTIVE TRUTH, THERE IS NOTHING MORE I CAN SAY OR
DO THAT WILL CONVINCE YOU.

IF YOUR BEST ARGUMENT IS

-----DNA IS FAKED BY THE BIGGEST DNA AND ANALYSIS PROVIDERS (FAMILY TREE DNA, 23ANDME, NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC)----

I CANNOT ARGUE ANYMORE, I FEEL LIKE I AM TALKING TO A DOG.

I REALLY HOPE THAT NUTRITION WILL ELEVATE **IQ** LEVELS IN INDIA AND HOPEFULLY WITH SOCIETAL EMPHASIS ON EDUCATION
BE ABLE TO COMPETE WITH CHINA.

@Rajan

DO YOU BELIEVE IN SCIENCE (DNA ANALYSIS) OR SOME RANDOM STATEMENTS MADE BY RANDOM PEOPLE ?

IF YOU BELIEVE IN RANDOM STATEMENTS AND NOT ON OBJECTIVE TRUTH, THERE IS NOTHING MORE I CAN SAY OR
DO THAT WILL CONVINCE YOU.

IF YOUR BEST ARGUMENT IS

-----DNA IS FAKED BY THE BIGGEST DNA AND ANALYSIS PROVIDERS (FAMILY TREE DNA, 23ANDME, NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC)----

I CANNOT ARGUE ANYMORE, I FEEL LIKE I AM TALKING TO A DOG.

I REALLY HOPE THAT NUTRITION WILL ELEVATE **IQ** LEVELS IN INDIA AND HOPEFULLY WITH SOCIETAL EMPHASIS ON EDUCATION
BE ABLE TO COMPETE WITH CHINA.

Muraleedharan said...

Historical facts are against St. Thomas story and churches established by him in Kerala :

Quotes >> ( From Wikipedia)

1. During the first two centuries of Christianity, the cross may have been rare in Christian iconography, as it depicts a purposely painful and gruesome method of public execution and Christians were reluctant to use it.
2. The earliest identified Christian house church is the Dura-Europos church, founded between 233 and 256.

Cross as a symbol of christianity was accepted much later.
Also earlier mass was conducted in houses . Construction of churches started centuries later.

Rajan Rajiv said...

@Anil This Anil is still blabbering about DNA. How do I deal with you who's completely irrational? Every time we disagree on a topic, I try to present evidence and information to support my position, and as a frustrated man when concrete facts are presented you do not get true facts and out of despair you are mean enough to use the word 'dog.'
Rev. C.Y.Thomas in his book, THE CSI MADHYA KERALA DIOCESE, says:" By 1840's missionaries started systematic evangelism among the non-Christians, especially those of the lower classes. In Mallappally Despite persistent persecutions, slave schools were opened in several places and the movement spread, gathering momentum with each new step. It is recorded that nine years after the first baptisms the Bishop of Madras visited the Mass Movement area and confirmed over a thousand outcaste Christians."
In Aleppey Norton converted thousands of Ezhavas. In Mallappaly Hawkswoth converted thousands of slaves. The descendants of thee lower caste converts are respectable Syrian Christians of toady. But you say DNA test will show they are of Jewish descent. This DNA is manipulated and no rational person will believe it.







Rajan Rajiv said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Rajan Rajiv said...

The Assyrians, also known as Syriacs, Chaldeans, and Aramaeans are an ethnic group whose origins lie in ancient Mesopotamia. They are Semitic people, who speak and write distinct dialects of Eastern Aramaic exclusive to Mesopotamia and its immediate surroundings.
Assyrians trace their ancestry back to the Sumero-Akkadian civilisation that emerged in Mesopotamia circa 4000–3500 BC, and in particular to the northern region of the Akkadian lands, which would become known as Assyria by the 24th century BC. The Assyrian nation existed as an independent state, and often a powerful empire, from the 24th century BC until the end of the 7th century BC. Assyria remained a Geo-political entity after its fall, and was ruled as an occupied province under the rule of various empires from the late 7th century BC until the mid-7th century AD when it was dissolved, and the Assyrian people have gradually become a minority in their homelands since that time. If we analyse historicaaly, there was no emigration of Assyrians between 7th century B.C and 7th century AD to Kerala. Kerala was too distaant and a strange country and they preferred nearby friendly countries in the Middle east. They are a Christian people, with most following various Eastern Rite Churches, although many are non-religious.
Although culturally similar, Assyrians are distinct linguistically, genetically and for the most part geographically from the Syrian Christians of Syria and Lebanon.
Many have migrated to the Caucasus, North America, Australia and Europe during the past century or so. Diaspora and refugee communities are based in Europe (particularly Sweden, Germany, Netherlands, and France), North America, New Zealand, Lebanon, Armenia, Georgia, southern Russia, Israel, Azerbaijan and Jordan. It is quite transparent from these historical events, there was no mass migration of Assyrians to Kerala. Even the migration of Sakas, Yeu-chi, Huns, Mongols are shown on the pages of Indian history. But there is absolutely no reference to mass Assyrian migration to Kerala. So it is all a false, distorted and twisted account prepared by racial writers of Kerala to appropriate Semitic race status for lower caste converts. They don't realize the difference between race and caste. Syrian Christian centres such as Kottayam, Mallappally, Pallom, Mundakayam, Ernakulam, Aluva, Alappuzha, Chengannur, Mavelikara, Thiruvalla, Kodukulanji etc were the main Mission Stations of CMS missionaries. Missionary journals and books tell us about the mass conversion of local people. They are now the mainstream Syrian Christian community. False and manipulated DNA cannot change the caste into race.

Unknown said...

There are lot of blogs available that "proudly" present syrian christian beef, syrian christian duck, syrian christian appam etc. etc. I think the greatest inventions by syrian christians are in the field of beef & appam preparation, but appam is disputed, i had read claims that appam was in kerala before syrian christians were formed or arrived in kerala . As a christian I do not know whether to laugh or cry when i think about syrian christians. I am praying to Lord Jesus to lead these people to truth that will set them free from the darkness of syrain christian superiority.

anil said...

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/syrianchristiansofindia/default.aspx?section=yresults

anil said...

@Rajan
You are one of those people who argue the world is flat and the world originated 5000 years ago. If you want to believe it is fine by me, however most people will
have trouble accepting this kind of crap.

What evidence are you talking about ? There is no greater evidence than DNA.



------ ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS BELOW ---

Why is every major DNA company in the world manipulating syrian christian DNA of kerala ?

Why do DNA providers based in America give a shit about a small population in some corner of the world ?



I am only going to argue based on science not based on your word of mouth.

I am willing to have a scientific argument based on DNA. Again, this is not about superiority.

THIS IS ABOUT OBJECTIVE TRUTH !!!!


I LOVE SCIENTIFIC ARGUMENTS, PLEASE PROVIDE AMPLE REASONS AS TO WHY POPULATIONS BELOW ARE CLOSER AND ANALYSIS BASED ON Y DNA.


-------- AUTOSOMAL ANALYSIS(COMPLETE DNA ANALYSIS) ------------

1,] "kerala-christian_harappa_7" "0"
[2,] "rajasthani_harappa_4" "2.994"
[3,] "singapore-indian-b_sgvp_41" "4.1918"
[4,] "tn-brahmin_xing_14" "4.6291"
[5,] "maharashtrian_harappa_4" "4.7937"
[6,] "iyer-brahmin_harappa_11" "4.9319"
[7,] "ap-brahmin_xing_25" "4.9891"
[8,] "iyengar-brahmin_harappa_7" "5.1369"
[9,] "karnataka-brahmin_harappa_4" "5.6943"
[10,] "meghawal_reich_5" "5.9054"
[11,] "up-muslim_metspalu_5" "7.1197"
[12,] "cochin-jew_behar_4" "7.4546"
[13,] "dharkar_metspalu_11" "7.4701"
[14,] "karnataka_harappa_4" "7.7441"
[15,] "andhra-pradesh_harappa_5" "7.8146"
[16,] "up-kshatriya_metspalu_7" "7.8495"
[17,] "ap-reddy_harappa_4" "8.1632"
[18,] "gujarati-b_hapmap_34" "8.2696"
[19,] "velama_metspalu_10" "8.4053"
[20,] "bihari-muslim_harappa_4" "8.6257"


----- Y DNA of SYRIAN CHRISTIANS FROM KERALA --------

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/SyrianChristiansOfIndia/default.aspx?section=yresults


PLEASE PROVIDE INTELLIGENT ARGUMENTS INSTEAD OF JUST SAYING DNA MANIPULATION. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE DON'T SAY DNA MANIPULATION !!!!

SORRY FOR CALLING YOU A DOG. IT CAME OUT OF SHEER FRUSTRATION AND HOW SOMEONE CAN JUST DISMISS ALL THE MAJOR DNA COMPANIES THE WORLD AS A JOKE.


Rajan Rajiv said...

You are showing a long list of manipulated DNA to claim Jewish genealogy to local converts as recorded by Persian, Portuguese and British missionaries.How can false DNA nullify authentic records of erudite and saintly missionaries?
WHEN DID THE JEWS COME TO KERALA?
There are some weird attempts without any inscriptional or literary evidences to establish the fact that St. Thomas converted Jews in Kerala. It is claimed without any evidence that there were Jewish settlements in Kerala from the days of King Solomonn It is true that Solomon’s ships came to India but it was not for bringing Jews to settle in Kerala but for the purpose of trade. Guided by Phœnician pilots, manned by Phœnician sailors, Phœnicians and Jews sailed forth together on their distant voyages, into the southern seas. They sailed to India, to Arabia and Somaliland, and they returned with their ships laden with gold and silver, with ivory and precious stones, with apes and peacocks. It was a trading mission and Jews were not brought in the ships for staying permanently in India. In those days when the Jews were living in all comfort and luxury in their own country there was no need for a Diaspora
Another claim of St. Thomas Christians without any basis is that they are the descendants of the Jews who came to Kerala during Diaspora. In their fanatical bid to disown their original caste of their own country and to appropriate for themselves the Jewish link they have been propagating the view that they are the progeny of the Jews of Diaspora. But the historical events of the period and the significance of Jewish Diaspora will prove their calculated attempts are nonsensical. The first Diaspora of the Jews in recorded history is the Baylonian exile. The Jewish Diaspora actually began in the year 597 BC with the seige and fall of Jerusalem by the Babylonians. Known as the Babylonian Captivity, a significant portion of the population of Judea was exiled to Babylonia, not to Kodungalloor in Kerala. This is confirmed in the Bible. The prophet Ezekiel lived in exile in Babylon during the period before and after the fall of Jerusalem in 586 B.C. Exiled Jews were escorted by soldiers and they could not escape from the crowd to come to Kodungalloor. There were two more diaspora according to scholars, and the Jews during this period went to Egypt, not to India which was a strange and far off country . So it is distortion of history to claim St. Thomas converted the Jews of Babylonian Exile when there were no Jews in Kodungalloor.The Diaspora continued with the Great Jewish Revolt, otherwise known as the First Jewish-Roman War, which began in the year 66 AD and ended in 70 AD with the destruction of Jerusalem. After the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D., Jews during this diaspora fled to Babylonia, Persia, Spain, France, Germany, Poland, Russia, and the United States, and not to India. What is more, St. Thomas was not anywhere in Kerala in 70 A.D. The oldest documentary evidence of a Jewish community in Kerala dates from 1000 CE, when a Jewish leader named Joseph Rabban received a set of engraved copper plates from the Hindu ruler of Cranganore. Since Rabban was treated with honor by the Raja, he was not a refugee but a rich merchant. Like the Portuguese, he would have established a factory in Kodungalloor to pursue his trade with the Mddle East. In all probability from that time onward only Jews would have come to Kerala in different phases through links with Joseph Rabban and his successors.

Rajan Rajiv said...

{continuation}
Another distortion of Kerla history by some Syrians is that there was a mass migration of Assyrians at the time of persecution in the Middle East. But Church history is quite explicit that In 341, the Zoroastrian Shapur II ordered the massacre of all Christians in the Persian Sassanid Empire. During the persecution, about 1,150 Assyrian Christians were martyred under Shapur II. When there was persecution in Persia, Christians fled to Iraq, Syria and Lebanon and they did not come to Kerala which was very distant and was having a different culture. Thomas of Cana was not at all involved in Shapur II's persecution and the claim that he brought 472 families, a bishop, several priests, 400 laymen etc., at the time of prersecution was a story invented by some Syrians who became rich and influential during Portuguese rule. Even Vasco da Gama and the Portuguese did not bring their wives on sturdy Portuguese ship. How could Thomas of Cana bring women and families in long voyages in rickety ships? Moreover, the Bishop in Persia at the time of Shapur's persecution was Yohanan bar Maryam of Arabela, and he is totally unaware of Thomas of Cana and the emigration of Christians from Persia. This Thomas of Cana story was invented in the 18th century by some family history writers like Niranam Granthavari to claim Jewish or Assyrian descent to lower caste converts elevated in status by the Portuguese. The earliest document bearing on the history of the Jewish community is the pair of copper plates which record a grant to the lrader of the Jews, Joseph Rabban in A.D. 379. The privileges given to Jews were copied in the alleged grant given to fictitious Thomas of Cana. Buchanan tried his best to trace the alleged copper plate given to Thomas of cana, but failed, although other copper plates given to the Jews were found. Later some fake plates called chepped were artificially produced without any authentic source regarding their origin.

Rajan Rajiv said...

I'm quoting Proverbs for your repeated projection of manipulated DNA to counter authentic historical facts.

26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his
own conceit.
I'm not prepared to argue with such a person.

jacob j said...

Mr Rajan Rajiv,

I should say that you're drawing wrong inferences from the data you collected. As you've stated, it is a fact accepted by all that the British CMS missionaries did convert a sizable number of lower caste Hindus to Christianity, especially from the Ezhava and Pulaya castes in the 19nth century. And these conversions took place mainly in places win and around Mallapally, Thiruvalla, Chengannur, Mavelikkara, Kumarakom, Kottayam and Pallom. But you are absolutely wrong in concluding that these neo-converts form the mainstream Syrian Christians of these places! That is a totally baseless claim with absolutely no evidence/record to substantiate with.

There are several books written on this subject, i.e. the admission of lower caste members to Christianity by the CMS Missionaries and the consequent response of the already existing Syrian Christian community in those regions. Based on historic records, you need to understand that,

1. The Syrian Christians identity was one that of a ethno-religious community right from the Pre portuguese times, and the community operated like a distinct caste altogether, with the practice of strict endogamy. This could be found in numerous Portuguese and dutch records of the 16nth and the 17nth centuries.

2. The British CMS missions initially targeted the Syrian Christian community, before even reaching out to the Low caste Hindus. It could be found in the early accounts of the missionaries that the Syrian Christians were highly 'caste conscious' and did not like the direct interference of the new missionaries in any of their affairs. Therefore the missionaries adopted a new method of approach whereby they sought to influence the Syrian christians through indirect means - that is by setting up seminaries, colleges and other institutions to educate them. However, the CMS continued with their policy of direct evangelization among the Hindu lower castes of the region, and admitted these neo-converts to the already existing Syrian Jacobite Churches of the region, as the CMS owned no parish churches in those regions by then. The Syrian Catholic faction however, had no such issues as they had been very rigid with the caste system, and admitted all their newly converted Hindu slaves (those converted from from the Ezhava/ Pulaya/ Paraya/ Nayadi/ Ulladan castes by the Syrian Catholic masters themselves and also by their clergy) in separate Latin churches in the same village. One can still see Latin Catholic churches in Syrian Catholic Christian strongholds like Kanjirapally, Pala, Changanasserry, Kuttanad, Cherthala, Thodupuzha etc.

3. The Syrian Jacobite Christians were greatly dissatisfied with this move of the British missionaries, and dissociated from the CMS evangelists. The neo-converts were forced out of their Syrian Churches and compelled to join the Anglican church. However, a small fraction of the neo-converts who managed to retain their membership in the Syrian churches were kept at a great distance by the mainstream Syrian Christians. They did not enjoy equal rights and privileges in the Church as their Syrian counterparts, as they were greatly discriminated. Many such neo-converts grew weary of their harsh treatments in the Syrian Churches, and left the churches to start new movements such as the PRDS, and many other independent groups of worship.

So i hope you've now understood these facts. Now you will not be able to stick to the false theory of "Low caste members' assimilation" into the Syrian Christian community. There was no such thing ever, as the Syrians had always remained a caste conscious lot!

jacob j said...

Rajan Rajiv,

What do you have to say about the following historic facts, that corroborate the fact that the Syrian Christians occupied a decent status in the Caste ridden society of Kerala?

1. The Nasranis (Syrian Christians) were called 'Mappilai' by Hindus, meaning 'bride groom', and this was clearly a term used for foreign settlers in Kerala. Therefore, the theory of Assyrian/Persian traders intermarrying local women seem highly plausible in this context. Remember, while the Hindu landlords of Kuttanad were called the 'Nayar thambraakkal', the more prominent Syrian Christian landlords of the region were called 'Mappila thambraakal'. This is mentioned in the works of Thakazhy Sivasankara Pillai.

2. The Nasranis, who were the traders and traders of Kerala (the southern Half of Kerala) prior to the portuguese colonization of the region, were highly regarded by the local Kingdoms. This can be seen from authentic state records, temple records, church records, and various genuine family records (of both Christian and Nair families) that mention about the numerous land grants (tax free) for building Syrian Churches and adjacent markets. The royalty in Kerala always favored the Syrian Christians for their contribution to the economy, and often appointed them as tax collectors, administrative representatives, officers and soldiers in their courts. Many Syrian Christian families hold surnames such as Tharakan, Pillai, Panicker etc, indicative the offices they held. The example of Sakthan Thamburan's efforts to settle Christians in Trissur and built a church for them in the late 18nth century is an example for the high states the Syrians enjoyed.

3. Syrian Christians, especially in the Cochin Kingdom, owned vast expanses of land. Family histories of Nairs in and around North Paravur, Angamaly and Irinjalakkuda mentions this fact. Many Nair families have even bought lands from such feudal families of the Nasranis.

4. The striking Genetic resemblance of the Syrian Chrsitians with that of the upper caste Hindus. There is a large presence of the R1a DNA (Aryan) haplotype among the Syrian Christians, which confirm their upper caste lineage.

jayesh... said...

@ jacob
First of all nasranis are not called as mapillas ,it is a name used to denote the muslim community in northern kerala coz as u rightly said,due the intermarriages with the local hindu community there,and the quote`nasrani thampurakkal' in a thakazhi novel cannot in any way support you in your argument,bcz it deals with the common man of that time and he will call his landloards as 'thampurakkal' only.

And offcourse the syrian christians were given some rights in medivial kerala,and defenitly that is bcoz of the excellence of them in trading ,nothing more ..which govt would not like to prosper in trade,bt remember the same status was given to muslims in northern kerala too.

Regarding R1A DNA,u all should know one thing ,India is considerd as the southern most gate of cauccasian race ,bcz even if u paste white colour on a very dark tamilian,he will surely resemble a n eastern european.And the genetic similarity and difference among indians will vary from person to person or from family to family,ie no two samples from `syrian nasrani'family will give you the same result.so the DNAs cant actually prove that nasranis are superior to other christians,who are converts

And among the so called suriyani christins one group especially `MARTHOMA SURIYANI CHRISTIANS' cannot actually boost about this suriyany heriditry,bcz around 65-70% are converted Ezhavas only.This can be easily usderstood if one look into the census of travancore in late 19th and early 20th centuries.their strong holds like mavelikkara,mallapally,kozhencherry,ranni,kumbanad,chenganoor all wre Ezhava strongholds,and still the largest group of other people residing there is Ezhavas only..!

jacob j said...

@ Jayesh,

1. Please understand that the term "Mappilai" is used to denote the Syrian Christians in the southern half of Kerala (i.e., from Thiruvananthapuram to Trissur), and the same refers to Moplah Muslims in the northern half of Kerala (Malappuram to Kasargode).

And Kerala history teaches us that there had been three types of Mappilais living on the Malabar coast for centuries, namely:
1. The Yehooda Mappila (the Jews)
2. Nasrani Mappila (the Syrian Christians)
3. Jonaka Mappila (the Moplah Muslims)

And it is obvious that the word 'Mappila' used for those communities points to the intermarriages between foreigners and the locals that actually gave rise to these ethnic groups.

2. You're right when you said that the Marthoma Church and some other Churches like the Syro Malankara Catholic church and the Orthodox church to a certain extant, has Ezhava converts constituting a part of their population, especially in parts of Pathanamthitta, Kollam and Alappuzha districts. But the original Syrian Christians in these churches barely maintain contacts with such neo-converts, and they can often be seen discriminated by the older Syrian folks. That is why, many Marthomites/Orthodox people are highly bothered about 'family names & heritage' (Kulamahima) when it comes to inviting alliances /marriage proposals for their Kids.

3. Nasranis where favored by the Hindus not only for their contribution to trade and commerce (which of course was the main reason), but also for their role as 'Purifiers' or 'neutralizers' of articles that were defiled by the touch of the untouchable lower castes. History books are replete with the records of Namboothiri families inviting Nasrani families to their villages/settlements where the latter had been absent previously. Temple articles, and other items like oil etc (which were handled by lower caste craftsmen, traders, servants etc) had to be 'purified' by the touch of Nasranis, and this role earned them a high position in the society. You can refer to historical records and confirm this. In fact this practice alone was the reason for the colonization/settlement of some Syrian Christian families in places like Muvattupuzha, Thodupuzha etc.

Unknown said...

Most of the Syrian Christians waste their entire time & energy in researching their caste status as a result they could not produce great writers, poets, great evangelists , philosophers etc. Forget this caste conscience. Now no body can find out with 100% accuracy who were the ancestors of syrian christians.Pushing fabricated stories to suit vested interests will not take us anywhere. Now syrian christians are malayali community and worshipping in malayalam language. Christian communities in Rome,Greece, Other Eastern Ortodox nations, Middle east and north Africa all developed great liturgies, literature in their languages. But our syrian christians in India failed completely in developing liturgies, Christian literatures etc. Now the time has come for the knowledgeable sections amoung syrian christians to introspect and think about their contributions to Christianity.

Rajan Rajiv said...

@jayesh
Mappilai, Moplah were words used by Keralites for all non-Hindus.The name of religion was also attached to differentiate non-Hindus --- Judah, Christian and Muslim Mappillai in its corrupt form Moplah. They were called Mappillais (husbands) because they were easily available to marry lower caste women of Kerala society. In the rigid caste structure of Keralan society, higher castes such as Brahmins and Nairs would not marry non-Hindus. Only in the 20th century, when these lower castes became wealthy and educated, the word 'Mappillai' was wrongly interpreted as 'Mahapillai.' Lengthy caste names such as Pisharodi, Nambudhiripad, etc., are not shortened. So the original word was Mappillai or Moplah, no abbreviation.
It is also wrong to say that certain sections of Syrian Christians ask for family names to fix marriages.I am told that in East Kerala Diocese many Jacobites have married Arayan CSI Christians who are IAS, doctors, and engineers.There is no such superior group of Syrians with a separate caste identity , although some may make false claims.
Your statement that Nambudhiris invited Syrians to stay in their villages has no historical evidence. It was a false propagands to claim superior status. In the same manner no Nambudhiri has invited Syrians to purify oil. Syrian Christians worked as oil merchants and they were called panikkars and chetties. It is the name of the trade and not caste. Some were even called 'mudali' because they owned shops.
The reality of the matter is that it was during the 150 year Portuguese rule Syrians who were living as lower castes, doing the work of lower castes, were pulled out of their low status, freed them from caste rules, and liberated them by appointing them to top posts, and even marrying them , to have a loyal Christian community to support them in a foreign country.So all the superior claims through manipulated family history -Niranam Granthavari, margamkali pattugal emanated from the post-Portuguese period. Till then they were lower castes in Hindu society.

Kariyachan said...

@ John Paul and Rajan Rajiv;
It is none of your business to prove the whole Syrian Christains as lower castes.I just wonder why you guys are spending hell lot of energy tp prove some one is inferior?

It is the karma which maketh nobility - not birth.

By the way I am Syrian Christain, and I don't want any waysider to validate and certify my roots and heritage. I know about my roots.
You worry about your roots.

Spend your energy on something meaningful .!

Rajan Rajiv said...

@kuriyachan
Mr. Abraham Tharakan is maiantaining this Blog for a scholarly debate. This Blog has become extensive with views and comments from many contributors. This blog can even compiled into a book.
I'm glad you know your root.I am pasting my reply to another contributor to another Blog of Mr. Tharakan. We accept Syrian Christians are wealthy, educated and well off in society. But the problem with some of them are their false claims as descendants of Nambudhiris, Jews and when these claims are proved historically and ethnically wrong by scholars, the recent laughable claim they are Assyrian descent. In our view they are all Indian Christians, like other Christians. Why the Moplahs, in spite of their wealth, education and complexion, do not claim they are Nambudhiri descent? They will never make such a claim because Kerala History tells they are lower caste converts of Malabar. But they are proud to be known as Malabar Muslims. Why don't you also say that you are an Indian or Kerala Christians without telling lies to borrow descent from another community which does not recognize you as its descendant?

Steve Finnell said...

WHAT DID THE FIRST CHRISTIANS BELIEVE?

THE CHURCH OF CHRIST HAD ITS BEGINNING ON THE DAY OF PENTECOST 33 A.D.. WHAT BELIEFS AND ACTIONS DID THE THREE THOUSAND CONVERTS TO CHRIST HAVE IN COMMON? DID GOD APPROVE OF EVOLVING BELIEFS, DIFFERENT REQUIREMENTS FOR SALVATION? IF THAT WERE TRUE, THEN WOULD IT NOT BE FOUND IN THE NEW TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES?

Acts 2:41 So then, those who received his word were baptized; and there were added about three thousand souls. Acts 2:47....And the Lord was adding to their number day by day those who were being saved.

All three thousand believed the apostle Peter's message and were baptized in water. Then they were added to the Lord's church by the Lord Himself. The Lord did not add the unsaved to His church. They had to believe and be baptized in water prior to being added to the body of Christ.

1. Acts 2:22 Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know---

All three thousand believed Jesus was a miracle worker.

2. Acts 2:31-32 he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that He was neither abandoned to Hades, nor did His flesh suffer decay. 32 This Jesus God raised up again, to which we are all witnesses.

All three thousand believed in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

3. Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ---this Jesus whom you crucified."

All three thousand believed that Jesus was Lord and Christ.

4. Acts 2:38 Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

All three thousand repented in order to have sins forgiven. (repentance meant that they made the commitment to turn from their unbelief and sinful lifestyle and turn toward God).

All three thousand were baptized in water in order to have their sins forgiven.

All three thousand received the indwelling gift of the Holy Spirit after they believed, repented, and were baptized in water.

5. Acts 2:40 And with many other words he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, "Be saved from this perverse generation!"

All three thousand were saved after they believed Peter's message: They believed, repented, confessed, and were baptized in water. (Mark 16:16, John 3:16, Acts 3:19, Acts 2:38, Romans 10:9-10, Acts 8:35-38) THEN THEY WERE ADDED TO THE LORD'S CHURCH! (Acts 2:47)

WHAT THINGS DID PETER NOT PREACH AND WHAT THINGS DID THE THREE THOUSAND NOT BELIEVE.

1.Peter did not preach that men were saved by grace alone.

2.Peter did not preach that men were saved by faith only

3.Peter did not preach that God had selected a few to be saved and that all others would go to hell.

4. Peter did not preach that water baptism was not essential to salvation.

5. Peter did not preach that Jesus was just one of many Saviors.

6. Peter did not preach that once you were saved, that you could continue in a sinful lifestyle and still be saved.

7. Peter did not preach that God did not have the power to give us an inerrant translation of the Scriptures.

8. Peter did not preach that God would provide hundreds or thousands of different Christian denominations, and that they would teach different ways of being saved.

9. Peter did NOT preach that you had to speak in tongues as evidence that you were saved.

AS BELIEVERS IN CHRIST, MEN SHOULD USE THE BIBLE AS THEIR GUIDE FOR SALVATION. Looking to man-made creed books, Bible commentaries, denominational statements of faith, and church catechisms, is looking in all the wrong places for the absolute truth!

YOU ARE INVITED TO FOLLOW MY BLOG. http://steve-finnell.blogspot.com

John Paul said...

This is in response to the posts of J.Jacob and Kariachan.
Originally, I had chosen to ignore J.Jacob’s posts because, in essence they are just repetitions of earlier boasts made by other Syrian Christians on their past though Jacob has also added detestable insults against Christians converted from the scheduled castes lately. But Kariachan has prodded me, mentioning me by name along with Rajiv Rajan and directing me not to ‘validate and certify’ his roots but worry about our roots. Therefore, I am forced to write this response. We are not trying to validate or certify his roots but to correct the gross untruths that are being proffered as ‘valid’ history of Syrian Christians. It is the duty of fair minded people to question vices like falsehood and deceit wherever and for whatever purposes they are is used. If Kariachan is interested only in one sided, often skewed and in many respects false narratives of Syrian Christian history, or gets touchy when others point out the not-much-known or discussed seamier side to it which has been hidden and replaced with false and fabricated narratives, then he should better ask Mr. Tharakan to close this blog so that others do not post comments unpalatable to Syrian Christians who prefer to remain forever in the state of blissful ignorance they are in. Indeed, it was Mr.Tharakan who decided in the first place to hold forth on the history of Christian conversions in Kerala and took the position that Syrian Christians were converted from the upper Caste Hindus and thereby invited comments that challenge his thesis and expose the fallacies in his position. Though Mr.Tharakan was thoughtful and circumspect in the choice of his language even while making contestable claims, other Syrian Christians who posted comments later went overboard in either praising their clan for their supposed high birth and outstanding qualities or in deriding other Christians or lower caste Hindus of Kerala. Kariachan says he already knows who he is! So my answer, if not given in detail, will not be sufficient to justify my spending time on posting comments in this blog which I don’t think stands for intellectual honesty or was created to give credible information to the thinking general public. This blog is rather of the Syrian Christians’ set up by a Syrian Christian for Syrian Christians’ who are only interested in narcissistically appreciating their imagined past, often miswritten and eulogized by vested elements among them and are averse to someone telling that there is an ugly side to it, warts and all. Therefore, those readers who find the following comments too long please excuse. Also, in writing this response, I do not intend to denigrate the small minority among Syrian Christians who are not casteist, petty minded or prejudiced, are modern in outlook, are decent gentlemen and are upright role models worthy of being emulated by all in society. My intention is to expose the hollowness of the claims made by J.Jacob and his ilk who are obviously possessed by the caste Devil and are afflicted with the common Syrian Christian disease that induces them to make fictitious and tall claims about their past even while insulting lower castes and Christian converts from such castes. Thus, I critically highlight some of the unacceptable and deplorable sides of the contemporary thought process and practices followed by most Syrian Christians. I also try to view their past from the perspective of an ordinary prudent person who prefers to rely more on chronicled and reasonable versions of their history rather than mythical or wishful versions. Therefore, it is hoped readers will join me in critically analyzing Syrian Christians’ many ideas and practices that are out of tune with the realities of modern times and also the fabricated, false and vainglorious narratives of their past as written by the quack-historians among them.

John Paul said...

fictitious and tall claims about their past even while insulting lower castes and Christian converts from such castes. Thus, I critically highlight some of the unacceptable and deplorable sides of the contemporary thought process and practices followed by most Syrian Christians. I also try to view their past from the perspective of an ordinary prudent person who prefers to rely more on chronicled and reasonable versions of their history rather than mythical or wishful versions. Therefore, it is hoped readers will join me in critically analyzing Syrian Christians’ many ideas and practices that are out of tune with the realities of modern times and also the fabricated, false and vainglorious narratives of their past as written by the quack-historians among them.
To begin with, I should lay clear a malaise that affects the vast majority of Syrian Christians, whereby many among them harbor a strong resentment verging on enmity towards lower castes in general and Christians converted from lower castes in particular. They lose no opportunity to malign and insult such converts as if they have snatched away some precious object from the Syrian Christians and so deserve to be reproached endlessly. Such snatched object is nothing but Christianity. Christ asked his disciples to go and preach his gospel to Jew and Gentile alike and so did his disciples, resulting in diverse populations embracing Christianity the world over. But Syrian Christians, though converted gentiles themselves, consider Christianity as their exclusive possession and preserve and are apparently convinced that other Christians in India have no right to be Christian or to be called Christian! (The Syrian Christians’ faith, if ever it can be called faith, is centered on and revolves around the socio-economic interests of their ethnic group and they appreciatively describe their creed as ‘ethno-centric’). The genesis of this queer conviction can be traced to the days when their unlettered ancestors in Kerala foolishly equated Christianity with caste. Such ancestors can be forgiven for their stupidity because their ancient rustic minds could not have been broad enough to comprehend or imbibe the lofty ideals that Christ had laid forth for mankind. But what about today’s so called educated Syrian Christians who practise this variety of caste tinged Christianity? One can only hope Christ will save and redeem their insular and insolent souls which they have so merrily mortgaged to the Caste Devil from the scorching flames of an ethno-centric hell that could await them. (Jews were also ethno-centric and we know the history of their Diaspora in Europe up till the Holocaust. Apart from getting branded as sub-human, millions of Jews got killed at the hands of the Nazi racists. Now, Syrian Christians of Kerala have also started having Diasporas in the US, Europe, Australia etc. and so it will be worthwhile for them to remember the history of the ethno-centric Jewish Diaspora of Europe, for as Santayana said, ‘those who do not remember history are condemned to repeat it’).

John Paul said...

The scorn and insults the Syrian Christians hurl at other Kerala Christians are mostly covert and indirect when circumstances demand discretion as when they are in an inferior position or as when they are telling their caste Hindu friends or acquaintances in private conversations with sneer and snigger, that ‘so and so’ is not a ‘real Christian’ (!) ie., not one of them but a low caste convert from ‘such and such’ caste ( Mukkuva, Nadar, Ezhava, Pulaya or whatever, on the stupid, idiotic presumption that the Syrian Christians are of Nampoothiri Brahmin stock) in a bid to smear the esteem for ‘so and so‘ in the listeners’ mind or while using internet fora and blog spaces to post insinuations as J.Jacob has done above. But sometimes the insults transform into overt name-calling and direct bullying when they feel emboldened enough, especially when they are in groups or gangs such as in places of work or common accommodation (like offices, college campuses, hostels, apartment blocks, places and neighborhoods where they are in a majority etc,).In the deranged minds of many Syrian Christians, the low caste converts are not Christians at all !! Such is the state of their mad delusion even now when the world has changed so phenomenally from what it used to be even fifty years ago. Unless and until they change these outdated, nonsensical and culturally backward attitudes and habits originally stemming from their peasant past and become modern in outlook, it will remain incumbent upon any right thinking person to harshly and relentlessly expose them and hold a mirror before their faces to show them and others who the Syrian Christians really are.

John Paul said...

The Syrian Christians’ contempt for the lower castes of Kerala who are actually their kinsmen who contributed heavily to their blood and numbers both in ancient and modern times, compels one to recollect the statement once made by Deshabandhu Chittranjan Das the eminent freedom fighter, on another hybrid race of India. In one of his famous speeches, the Deshabandhu derided them thus: “…………………….are the standing monuments that remind us of the adultery that India was forced into” (by the White colonizers).He was venting his fury against their support for the British Raj in India in those days and the contempt they displayed towards everything Indian. Similarly, even in the present era of enlightenment when human dignity is considered to be of paramount importance in societies all over the world, the Syrian Christians of Kerala see the lower castes here with disdain. We also witness the Syrian Christians’ insistence on structuring their Churches on ethnic lines to the exclusion of the so called lower caste Christians (which is well-nigh impossible given that very large numbers of pure lower caste/scheduled caste later converts are masquerading among Syrian Christians as clan members, thereby neatly fooling the rabid caste maniacs among them). Again, we witness the fiery arguments and internecine fights by and between the various factions of Syrian Christians (of the Orthodox kind and its clones) in ardent support of either a foreign Orthodox Patriarch who sits in Syria and personifies their foreign lineage or an Orthodox Catholicose in Kerala who is accused of usurping the Patriarch’s powers, pelf and properties while laying claim to the same foreign lineage nevertheless. We further hear the shrill demands (of the Catholic kind) for the adoption of more Chaldean rites (Kaldayavalkaranam) in Syrian catholic liturgy (even when they already follow many Chaldean rites in their liturgy, though in Malayalam) and for the revival of ancient Nestorian symbols like the Persian cross by a Syro-Malabar catholic faction in deference to their bigot-of-a retired Arch Bishop’s wishes to follow their Assyrian/ Chaldean (Iraqi) lineage. Still further, we witness the competitive zeal and haste with which the Syrian Orthodox and Syrian Catholic Churches (along with their clones) are setting up Dioceses and Bhadrasanams and appointing Bishops in every nook and corner of India and the world in the name of providing pastoral care to their people settled in such places even when other equally qualified local Churches are well equipped to provide pastoral care in those places to whichever Christian folk needing it. Surely then, when new Dioceses and Bhadrasanams are being set up at accelerating speed, it is the greed for leadership and control and the riches it brings, that motivate them and their clergy. Under such circumstances, after having witnessed the above graceless and plebian antics of the Syrian Christians, can any patriotic Malayalee be faulted if he chooses to echo C.R.Das’ original denunciation and cry “Syrian Christians are the standing monuments that remind us of the adultery that ancient Kerala was forced into”( by seaborne traders from West Asia), to vent his fury against their contempt for lower castes, or against their ethnically driven loyalties to west Asian culture and faith systems or against their clannish and nepotic attitude and approach to the practice of Christian values? The Syrian Christian’s fanatic affinity for West Asian ethno-religious culture certainly arose in the past from blood ties that bind the two as in the proverb ‘ Blood is thicker than Water’ (West Asian blood mixed with that of the low caste Kerala aborigines’ though) and also could possibly have arisen from the insecurities they felt as a mongrel people burdened with the stigma of bastardisation in the bygone centuries, since building strong ties with the culture of their forefathers must have been advantageous in many ways , especially in securing concessions from the rulers of Kerala for the conduct of spice trade with West Asia.

John Paul said...

As other Christian faith-streams started appearing in Kerala along with the Europeans, the fear of becoming overwhelmed by European influences that stressed on the egalitarian Christian values of fraternity and charity and tended to bunch Syrian Christians along with the newly converted Christians (in this context it must be noted that for the typical European eyes of those days, all Indians,- irrespective of caste or local standing ie., whether Brahmin, Kshatriya, Mukkuva, Pulaya, Pariah or Syrian Christian-, were the same hideously backward lot, one indistinguishable from another) and the possibility of becoming marginalized, distressed them no end. Just as the Anglo-Indians (Indians of Eurasian ancestry) commanded esteem from native Indians later in history by virtue of the fair skin many of them inherited from Europeans, the Syrian Christian hybrids were tolerated by caste Hindus and were allowed to carry on with the spice trade of their forefathers by virtue of the fair skin many in their clan inherited from West Asians. Thus, they involved in the local buying of spices and other products from Hindus or their hybrid or tribal kinsmen settled in the interior areas and selling it to either Muslim Arabs or European sea-traders. The caste Hindu local rulers collected their tax revenue from the proceeds and so granted them some privileges in return. Therefore, as the European missionaries amalgamated them with the newly converted Christians from among the lower castes and tried to make them drop the unchristian, superstitious and unacceptable dark mores and practices they were following (practice of black magic, belief in astrology and omens, concubinage, fornication and adultery etc., or the Nestorian ideas that denied the divinity of Jesus Christ in his human state and were antithetical to universally accepted Christian theology) and bring their beliefs in line with that of contemporary thought, they were not willing to change their mores lest they be downgraded by the caste Hindus and thereby lose the privileges and lucrative concessions in the inland spice trade they managed to secure by passing off as high caste converts. This also induced the Syrian Christians to lay claim to an arguably superior ethno-religious pedigree (that also catered to their world view of self-centeredness as against Christian values of universal charity and human fraternity) by invoking their original half-caste West Asian ethnicity and faith (in addition to a false claim that they were converts from the Brahmin nobility of Kerala with an eye to dupe the caste Hindus). Thus, their leaders took ungrateful and vicious positions against European missionaries (who gave them a voice by lifting them from the unlettered state they were in by imparting formal schooling and organized them into a viable social group from that of a cluster of rag-tag disparate elements scattered far and wide in primitive tribal mode and subsisting on the mercy of local rulers) in the ‘Coonan Cross oath’ (oath taken before a slanting Cross) in Mattancherry and later in the ‘Mavelikkara Padiyola’ (Memorandum/Resolution written on Palm Leaf, moved in a gathering in Mavelikkara) citing their strong ethno-religious ties with West Asia.

John Paul said...

But this strategy is of no particular use to Kerala Syrian Christians at present, since , as we all know, the Orthodox Christians in West Asia (Syria or Iraq or Palestine or Iran) have become a weak , insignificant and miniscule minority in their lands of birth, their numbers gobbled up long ago by their Muslim cousins by means of forced conversion to Islam and so have next to nothing to offer in material terms to the forlorn offspring their seafarer ancestors sired with low caste aborigine women in far away Kerala in ancient times. Even as I write this piece, whatever numbers that remain of the Orthodox/Assyrian/ Chaldean Christian population in Northern Iraq are running away from ISIS controlled areas like Mosul and Nineveh and Qaraqosh fearing for their lives as the ISIS Sunni Muslim Jihadi groups of the newly declared Khilafat (which has taken political and military control of parts of Syria and Iraq) have issued an ultimatum to them to either convert to Islam or pay protection tax or face their guns. Joseph Thomas, the Chaldean Archbishop of Kirkuk in Iraq (yes, the Iraqi Archbishop too has the typical name of a Kerala Syrian Catholic) bemoans the pathetic situation of his people now as ‘catastrophic, a crisis beyond imagination’. If the Khilafat manages to militarily overrun the whole of West Asia, just imagine the fate that could befall the Orthodox/Chaldean Christians and their poor helpless Bishops and Patriarchs there!

John Paul said...

So, only blood ties between West Asian orthodox Christians and Kerala Syrian Christians hold value and are relevant now. What other reason will suffice to explain the unfailing proclivity of the Syrian Christians of Kerala to blindly ape and fall head over heels for the dubious charms of the exclusivist, rigid and ethno-centric Christian creeds of West Asia? West Asian ecclesiastic cultural mores were always subject to repeated and consistent squabbles and unruliness so typical of West Asian society and they have a track record of incessant quarrels either among themselves or with the Roman Church throughout history ( to gauge West Asian unruliness, check the history of upheavals and fights in Saddam Hussein’s or Maliki’s present day Iraq, Assad’s –both father’s and son’s- Syria, Lebanon of the Shias and Maronites, Palestine of the Hamas and Fatah and Iran of the violent and ruthless Ayatollahs and cross check this general feature to find perceptible similarities with the unrelenting squabbles our very own Syrian Christians have been indulging in for centuries now, either between themselves or with others). Thus, in line with their West Asian cousins’ and patrons’ ways, or perhaps not to be left far behind, Syrian Christians of Kerala too have chosen to be pugnacious, inward looking and exclusivist in their faith when other Churches the world over are exhorting believers to be tolerant, more inclusive in their outlook and loyal to their respective countries’ cultural systems even while being universal in their Christian faith. Mercifully, other Christians in India are abiding by such exhortations, have tried and still trying to spread Jesus’ message to the masses in simple ways and in languages easily understood just like Jesus did when he ministered to the lame and the leper or when he spoke in parables (check the preaching’s and works of the likes of Mother Teresa or Sadhu Sunder Singh). Is there any chance that Syrian Christians will start listening to Jesus’ teachings on the need for true Christians to ‘love thy neighbor’? No way! They have chosen to remain an obstinate and cantankerous lot. They are not just ethno-centric but appear to prefer to be an altogether different species, steadfastly claiming religio-cultural exclusivity and superiority over other Christians of India! The scorn and contempt they hold such Christians in, make them go around branding such other Christians as ‘converts’ (or the condescending, contemptuous and derogatory sounding ‘neo-converts’ of Jacob’s post) as if they are second class Christians or unworthy Christians. What else is this, if this is not proof of the unchristian, heathen corruption and dirt that pervade the Syrian Christians’ minds and souls? It can be seen how much it has vitiated and poisoned their character from Dr.Johnson’s words. ”Contempt is a kind of gangrene, which if it seizes one part of a character, it corrupts all the rest by degrees” –Samuel Johnson. The funny side to this otherwise absurd conceit that has gone into the head of many Syrian Christians is that most of the Latin Catholics of Kerala,Tamil Nadu, Goa, Mangalore etc., who have a five hundred year history as Christians (some Latin Catholics claim more than that), could claim more antiquity and tradition then very large numbers of Syrian Christians who were converted or co-opted from lower castes/schedule castes/Scheduled Tribes ( Pulayas, Parayas, Kuravas,Nayadis,Tribals etc.) during the period between 16th to 20th centuries, only to dissolve without a trace into the main stream of Syrian Christian society and are dumb enough to now believe the stupid canard that they too are Nampoothiri Brahmin nobles supposedly converted by St.Thomas two thousand years ago!

John Paul said...

At various points in their history, Syrian Christians of Kerala hitched their faith precepts to different ecclesiastical orders. This began with the East Syriac Nestorian creed brought by Persian missionaries in the 6th century AD from which they drifted into an almost irreligious, quasi-Animist primitive way of life with very few Christian ideas guiding them beginning the 10th century till they got instructed in religion and shifted to Latin rite Roman Catholicism under the Portuguese in the 16th century. Still later, post-Coonen Cross quarrel with the Portuguese, they forked out in two directions with the dominant faction choosing Roman Catholicism under European Bishops and the inferior faction choosing West Syriac orthodox rite with the erstwhile ‘Arkadhiakons’ (which was Kerala vernacular variant of the Portuguese word ‘Arquidiacono’ meaning Archdeacon- a religious title given by the Portuguese to the person who was earlier known as ‘Malankara moopan’ or ‘jathi karthvyan’ ie., ‘Clan elder’ of Kerala Syrian Christians who then existed in a more or less tribal mode) donning the mantle of Syrian Orthodox Metropolitans and calling themselves successively as Marthoma I, Marthoma II, Marthoma III etc., in imperial style (like the Roman Ceasers or Persian Shahanshas of yore) with the Patriarch of Antioch and other west Asian Metropolitans periodically acting as back-seat drivers in the administration of their new Church or as umpires (often partisan) in the inevitable internal squabbles that were to follow and were inherent to their nature or sometimes arriving in person to become enthusiastic conductors of their ‘brawl-harmonic’ orchestra. Only the Jacobite faction remains loyal to the Patriarch of Antioch now. But the state of affairs in all the factions are such that, even now, skirmishes and fights could break out suddenly and from nowhere with all the players ie., Bishops, priests and laity becoming equally involved in the dog-fights, none found too wanting in the display of fanatic commitment and wild passion for their cause which will often be the demand for positions or pelf. Such is their pitiful understanding of the value of Christian spiritual pursuit, an understanding shared in equal measure by the Syrian Christian Bishops, Priests and Laity! (This month’s incident is within the Jacobite Church. Four Bishops of the Church were transferred by their Catholicose without their consent and they appealed to the Patriarch in Antioch who cancelled their transfers which has made the Catholicose and his cronies resentful. We have to wait and watch to find out what happens next ie., whether a split or defections to the Orthodox faction will follow or if the fight will just simmer for the time being only to explode into a bigger one later).

John Paul said...

The various splits and fragmentation that resulted from the continuous fights between the orthodox factions over positions, property and money that went on and on over the centuries created the many clones that called themselves Marthoma, Anglican, CSI, Malankara Catholic, Evangelical, Pentecostal and what have you? Meanwhile, the faction that chose Roman Catholicism waited till the late twentieth century to conceive and devise their unique way to salvation and came up with the idea of an Epy-Archy Major Archbishoporic with East-Syriac Chaldean rites under Rome with independence to run their affairs (read full control over positions of power and the money it generates) and called themselves the ‘Syro- Malabar’ Church (whoever but the Syrian Christians could have had the wonderful idea of giving themselves a name that rhymes with Zero!).All these fights and the resulting splits originated from their craving for power and privilege and the accompanying economic benefits such splits could bring. The Syrian Christian’s propensity and slick ability to tailor his faith in accordance with the changing tides of time, with the focus always on the economic benefits that could accrue, have now become the stuff of legends (but their quack-historians have the temerity to blame the Portuguese for their splits!).We need only reflect on the various US based churches having a field day now in Kerala and the quantity of funds flowing into the pockets of the Syrian Christian Pastors of such churches or the quantity of money flowing in from Europe and the US into the coffers of the older churches to have an idea of the extent to which the Syrian Christians have transformed Christ’s Church originally founded to redeem the needy toiling masses, ostracized ones and outcastes, into a money spinning machine!

John Paul said...

To what extent Syrian Christians of Kerala remain mentally imprisoned within the walls set by West Asian aberrations called ‘religious tradition’ can be understood from some of their earlier and present customs that are stark enough to be noticed by any interested person. The West Asians used to have Bishoprics that ran in families as decided and imposed by unscrupulous, power-grabbing Bishops and Patriarchs. The Nestorian East Syriac Bishops of ancient and medieval Persia (region comprising present day Iran and Iraq) were used to anointing their brothers, nephews and family members as Bishops with nonchalant impunity. In medieval times it began with the Church of the East (Persian Church) Patriach Mar Shemon IV Bassidi of the 15th century. This continued with his successors so that Mar Shimon VII Ishoyab even appointed a twelve year old nephew of his, as Metropolitan Bishop and successor. (Just imagine the erudition or exposure to doctrinaire principles of faith a twelve year old boy wielding ecclesiastical authority could have!) History says that Mar Shiomon VII Ishoyab, like many of his predecessors and successors, was used to a hedonistic and free-wheeling life style and that he had no problem tolerating concubinage amongst his folk. Concubinage and loose morals were, after all, a reality of ancient and medieval West Asian life (which followed in their wake to Kerala shores too) so much so that Muslim jurisprudence that prevailed in West Asia later, had to restrict a Muslim man’s number of wives at a time to four. But a West Asian Pagan or nominal Christian was free to have any number of wives (on the grounds of the Islamic principle of tolerating the customs of followers of other religions). Concubinage was not curbed either. So the West Asian Christians continued taking concubines just for pleasure especially since concubinage was tied to slavery too. Our Syrian Christians’ ancient paternal cousins the Persian Zoroastrians even had marriage customs that were incestuous! This revolting practice that was taboo for other societies was copied by the Nestorian Persian Christians in the 3rd century only to be curbed by a Bishop later. Such was the perverted sexual morality followed by early Nestorian Christians of Persia. But surprisingly, such traditional customs of West Asians were tolerated even after the advent of Islam, by Omar the Great, conqueror of Persia and 1st Caliph of the magnificent Rashidun Caliphate in the name of religious freedom accorded by Islam.

John Paul said...

The Syrian Christians of Kerala blindly and most faithfully followed the West Asian custom of taking concubines throughout their history till recently. Marriage was not a sacrament for the Nestorian Christians and they were free to divorce or take different wives at different times or more than one wife at a time. The Syrian Christians of Kerala, who were followers of East Syriac Nestorian rites till the Portuguese arrived, thus had many wives and concubines (note the mythical Kanai Thommen of Syrian Christian lore too had two wives one of them an aborigine Indian!). The Nestorian Bishops and priests could marry too. Syrian Christian Katthanars ie.,Moopens’ or tribal elders, who were later instructed on the details of Christian religious practice and called Deacons by the Portuguese. It is said that these Katthanars were more interested in the buying and selling of pepper and in making money and not in religious matters. This was because the early Nestorian Bishops and Katthanars were merchants and religious officials at the same time. These Katthanars too were no exception to the habit of following polygamy and are chronicled to have had many wives and concubines. This habit continued even after they fell out with the Portuguese and, as chronicled, some Syrian Christian women even functioned as concubines for both Syrian Christians and Hindu Nairs! (This could explain some Syrian Christians claiming kinship with Nairs). They are still (proudly!) following in the foot-steps of the likes of Mar Ishoyab in that they too have the so called families that supply Bishops on hereditary and dynastic lines to this day– Pakalomattom etc. (check the family background –as claimed by Syrian Christians- of many of their earlier Metropolitans and present Bishops. Also, check the background of Isaac Mar Cleemis who was just a junior priest when he was first elevated Auxiliary Bishop and was junior to all the Bishops of the Malankara Catholic Church in age and experience when he was later elevated Archbishop, Catholicos and Cardinal). These hereditary claims to Bishoprics in Kerala that are still current are regressive imitations of ancient and medieval West Asian custom, starting with the policy of the 17th century Archdeacons (that the so called Pakalomattom family of Nampoothiri Brahmin descent was ordained to priesthood by St.Thomas is utter nonsense and is a post- Portuguese-arrival fabrication made by the Arkadhikions themselves). Archdeacon Thomas, said to be of the Pakalomattom family, proclaimed himself Marthoma I, then went on to anoint his nephew as Marthoma II which progressively continued to his grand nephew as Marthoma III and then his grand nephew’s nephew as Marthoma IV and so on in true West Asian style. This is similar to the political dynasties we now have in India and shows that the Syrian Christians are not concerned about the merits or spiritual calling of their ‘spiritual leaders’. For them, ‘spirituality’ is a talent that runs in families, the talent for wielding power and playing politics!

John Paul said...

Again, Syrian Christian liturgy, as adopted from West Asia, is at times littered with and at times mostly celebrated in an ancient dead language (Aramaic/old Syriac) that is unintelligible to and makes no sense to modern listeners in Kerala. The irony is that old Syriac was indeed the language of the peasantry in West Asia and hence was adopted by early Christian leaders there as the language of liturgy because the peasant masses could not follow Greek, the language of the aristocracy which was used in liturgy till then! The same ancient language which was once used to instruct the masses in West Asia on the essence of liturgical practices, remains imposed to this day on the orthodox Syrian Christian peasant masses of Kerala who know no language other than Malayalam! And this is just for the sake of following tradition. No wonder the Syrian Christians’ understanding of the basic tenets of Christianity (like Christ’s teachings on love or compassion or humility or service or sacrifice) remains shallow and limited.-.........(to be continued).

John Paul said...

CAME TO KNOW OF THE SAD DEMISE OF MR.ABRAHAM THARAKAN TODAY FROM THE MALAYALA MANORAMA. THE OBITUARY SAYS HE WAS 81 YEARS OLD AND WORKED AS GENERAL MANAGER OF M/S APPOLO TYRES LTD. EARLIER. BY AIRING HIS VIEWS ON THE HISTORY OF CHRISTIANITY IN KERALA IN THIS BLOG MR.THARAKAN PAVED THE WAY FOR MANY OF US TO POST CONCURRING OR CONTRADICTING VIEWS ON CHRISTIANITY AND THE CONNECTED SOCIAL HISTORY OF KERALA.THE DISCUSSION IS ONGOING AND HAS PROMPTED MANY TO TAKE A SECOND LOOK AT ALL THAT WAS TAKEN FOR GRANTED TILL NOW.THUS, HIS WORKS WILL FAR OUTLIVE HIM. I EXPRESS MY CONDOLENCES TO HIS FAMILY. RIP.

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